How to learn about the curse?

He is normally a heavy drinker.


He is not normally known for provinces sex


He is not normally known for bisexuality


He is not normally known for over eating


he /never/ uses hard drugs such as heroin.


In one day he dose all these things.


It’s not the day he can afford to take of to relax, any more than the last 10.


Edward
 
in·dulge       Pronunciation Key - Show Spelled Pronunciation[in-duhlj]


1. to yield to an inclination or desire; allow oneself to follow one's will (often fol. by in): Dessert came, but I didn't indulge. They indulged in unbelievable shopping sprees.


–verb (used with object)


2. to yield to, satisfy, or gratify (desires, feelings, etc.): to indulge one's appetite for sweets.


3. to yield to the wishes or whims of; be lenient or permissive with: to indulge a child.


4. to allow (oneself) to follow one's will (usually fol. by in): to indulge oneself in reckless spending.


5. Commerce. to grant an extension of time, for payment or performance, to (a person, company, etc.) or on (a bill, note, etc.).


o·ver·in·dulge  


  1. To indulge (a desire, craving, or habit) to excess: overindulging a fondness for chocolate.


  2. To indulge (a person) excessively: overindulges his children.


If you note these two definitions you will realize that Overindulging is not as extreme as you suggested


Overindulging in food is eating until full rather than merely replete, if you have to loosen your belt 2 holes then you have overindulged, more than one slice of dessert is overindulging.


Overindulging in alcohol literally means getting drunk.not drinking the place dry.


you really need to look and see what those words mean
 
Yeah of course, this never happens to ordinary humans and could really not be explained with the stress. That temperance 5 solar is positively the very first human EVER who broke down and partied hard in ways he did not do before... not.


Besides, he is probably known for drugs, bisexuality and the likes, too, because after his first limit break he probably had around 15 willpower and thought "hey, getting laid by guys while skyhigh on drugs feels good" (oh and I know that this could lead to some rather nasty quotes ^^)
 
okay if you are burning all your willpower to ignore a virtue then you are not playing your char according to how you built him


hell do it enuff and I would probably rule that the virtue in question just lost some dots


or merely penalize xp
 
okay if you are burning all your willpower to ignore a virtue then you are not playing your char according to how you built him
hell do it enuff and I would probably rule that the virtue in question just lost some dots


or merely penalize xp
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You are talking out of your arse.
 
how so?
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Look at your very own defintions. Look hard and you will perhaps realize the mistake. But that was not what I was talking about.


You "create" this perfectly stupid character with temperance 5 who is a heavy drinker, thinking it will break the system, I show you, it doesn't, you choose to not address that and throw totally unrelated and most of the time simply wrong or nearly unrelated stuff at the arguement and afterwards complain that this character would be roleplayed wrong if he would burn willpower all the time and you would cut down on his xp.


So, let me quickly recap what we got. We got a heavy drinker with high temperance. He has to burn willpower to indulge in drinking, meaning following his vices weakens his resolve, but he likes this vice, so from time to time he gives in, burns a little willpower and drinks instead of doing his duty and from time to time he snaps and parties hard because he had to keep himself from drinking so hard (despite the fact that he failed sometimes).


In my eyes this is a perfect example of someone portraying a monk or something who just can't live without his booze. Why on earth would you tell him that he doesn't properly play his character and even punish him?!


A drinker with temperance 5 surely is a torn character, I see no problem whatsoever with any of the results the limit break system gets us for him.
 
On the original topic about the curse, noticing a flaw in a character may be apparent.  Noticing it's a curse laid down by the Neverborn, is definitely not apparent.  Yes the curse was noticed in the First Age (not surprising considering the majority of Solars were disgustingly powerful individuals with titanic essence scores).  But the curse WASN'T noticed readily in the other exalted.  Sidereals are oblivious to their curse, Lunars (and other exalted) attribute theirs to their connection with Luna and nature, and the Dragon Blooded's is minuscule in comparison to the others.  The only curse that was readily apparent to anyone, was the Solars...  and even then no one realized it for what it is.  That there was something wrong, was apparent.  That there was more to it than a simple matter of 'power corrupts'...  not apparent.  


Yes, many Exalted Solars have probably realized they messed up big in their past lives.  Yes, many exalted know the *some* of the Solars were corrupt tyrants.  But nowhere in creation would anyone have any clue as to the cause of all this...(IMHO).  I still say that the best way to fully 'learn' that all the essence shards are corrupt is either in an all-Abyssal game, or to have the players find out by *accidentally* stumbling across the mouth of the void and the neverborn in the Labyrinth, next time they go there.
 
What about a solar realizing there is something wrong with themselves but being unable to believe that its there fault.


Real people often have difficulty accepting there own flaws are there own fault. I can see a solar suspecting a flaw in the shard because he can’t admit there could be a flaw in himself, and then searching for a way to fix the flaw. It would be sad if he wasn’t right by no merit of his own.


Obviously this shouldn’t apply to all characters.


Edward
 
What about a solar realizing there is something wrong with themselves but being unable to believe that its there fault.
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There's still a difference between "someone cursed me", and "someone cursed my Essence". Even still, I'd be inclined to attribute it in-character to a quirk of the fusion of mortal body and divine spirit, not the death-curse of the dying creator-gods.
 
Note that even if you fail to realize the source of the problem (which would usually require a lot of metagame thinking...without a direct info source telling you), you can still potentially notice that exalts tend towards...extreme behaviour. If that seems a problem as far as you're concerned, then it wouldn't be odd to try to find a way to stop it...whether only for yourself, you and your allies, or for exalted as a whole, or just for those crazy anathema...


Of course, paranoia about the madness of the exalted might just be a form of your own curse manifesting... ;)
 
Safim said:
how so?
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Look at your very own defintions. Look hard and you will perhaps realize the mistake. But that was not what I was talking about.


You "create" this perfectly stupid character with temperance 5 who is a heavy drinker, thinking it will break the system, I show you, it doesn't, you choose to not address that and throw totally unrelated and most of the time simply wrong or nearly unrelated stuff at the arguement and afterwards complain that this character would be roleplayed wrong if he would burn willpower all the time and you would cut down on his xp.


So, let me quickly recap what we got. We got a heavy drinker with high temperance. He has to burn willpower to indulge in drinking, meaning following his vices weakens his resolve, but he likes this vice, so from time to time he gives in, burns a little willpower and drinks instead of doing his duty and from time to time he snaps and parties hard because he had to keep himself from drinking so hard (despite the fact that he failed sometimes).


In my eyes this is a perfect example of someone portraying a monk or something who just can't live without his booze. Why on earth would you tell him that he doesn't properly play his character and even punish him?!


A drinker with temperance 5 surely is a torn character, I see no problem whatsoever with any of the results the limit break system gets us for him.
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actually i described him as a teetotaler


this guy never touched drink his entire mortal life


the weakness for alcohol came with exaltation,it is a thing that tearsinto his soul


therefore it wasnot present prior to exaltation


so now he flipflops between his usual ascetic self and a coplete hedonist...


and you suggest that nobody willnotice that the exaltation changed his personality?


YOU responded with a heaver drinker with temperance 5...


temperance 5 characters should not be heavy drinkers...


this is an aspect of a chargen system where personality traits are statted
 
so what is the tragic flaw of this pedo hunter?
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That he totally misses the point.  No wait, that's your flaw.


"To Catch a Predator" talks about otherwise-respectable people from all walks of life, who have a hidden secret.  While it may cause them shame and disgrace and sorrow, they still can't simply stop it.  It causes them to be seen as monsters once exposed.  It drives them away from their friends and family, it dehumanizes them in the eyes of the populace, and it confuses even the men themselves, who sometimes cannot explain why or how they act on these urges.


From "M", the 1931 Fritz Lang film:


Hans Beckert: What do you know about it? Who are you anyway? Who are you? Criminals? Are you proud of yourselves? Proud of breaking safes or cheating at cards? Things you could just as well keep your fingers off. You wouldn't need to do all that if you'd learn a proper trade or if you'd work. If you weren't a bunch of lazy bastards. But I... I can't help myself! I have no control over this, this evil thing inside of me, the fire, the voices, the torment!


Schraenker: Do you mean to say that you have to murder?


Hans Beckert: It's there all the time, driving me out to wander the streets, following me, silently, but I can feel it there. It's me, pursuing myself! I want to escape, to escape from myself! But it's impossible. I can't escape, I have to obey it. I have to run, run... endless streets. I want to escape, to get away! And I'm pursued by ghosts. Ghosts of mothers and of those children... they never leave me. They are always there... always, always, always!, except when I do it, when I... Then I can't remember anything. And afterwards I see those posters and read what I've done, and read, and read... did I do that? But I can't remember anything about it! But who will believe me? Who knows what it's like to be me? How I'm forced to act... how I must, must... don't want to, must! Don't want to, but must! And then a voice screams! I can't bear to hear it! I can't go on! I can't... I can't...
 
so you were showing tragically flawed average joes, not tragically flawed heroes
cool


now it makes sense
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Still not getting it.


The point is that even in the real world, people can and do grapple with internal motives that might SEEM to be foreign to their natures.  Whether you're a hero or not doesn't enter into it - "heroism" as such simply influences how you'll respond to those things.
 
yes they do, but you miss the other point


when someone WITHOUT THOSE MOTIVES suddenly develops them at the same time as he gets awesome powers


something is amiss
 
I checked my core book again. It nowhere states that you become a heavy drinker due to exaltation or gain new vices. Where is that stated please? There is also no signature character doing this.


Oh, and for the record. I am of memesis' opinion. This is probably the thrid time or so and the world is still moving and stuff... I am positively surprised by the toughness of our little planet ^^
 
using willpower is using your free will to act against your true nature


therefore your virtues are your true nature


thuse statistically speaking someone with temperance 5 will iindulge in a vice 7.8% of the times it is available and suggested


with temperance 4, 13% of the time


with temperance 3: 21.6% of the time


long story short version, at temperance 3 you will rarely drink heavily


at temperance 4 you will do so very rarely


at temperance 5 maybe one heavy drinkoing session per year (assuming 2 drinking invites per week)


now this person changes, overnight, into someone who drinks the pub dry on a weekly basis


(if you assume that they guy starts to use willpower to drink more often after this so he binges less often he will most likely binge without willpower, and thus will be completely unable to use partial control)


your descrioptions of a couple of barmaids and a keg or 2 would be an example of partial control


remember the description explicitly says you will steal to support the party if you don't have enough money.


you will force people to help your party, which means consent is a non issue to you, social charms or just plain rape are the acts of the day
 
There is also the fact that the curse you're so extremely hot on doesn't fit the idea you're so hot on. If the man has a will of iron and never drinks, not even socially before... why would YOU as a player inflict THAT specific curse on him, when there are better fitting curses. And if there are none, you MAKE one for him. One that FITS his personality.


And unless his concept is Hyde and Jekll, it simply doesn't work. As you note, he'll be snapping between extremes when he limit breaks. There has to be some association there, something that connects HIM as a character to the curse that is on him.
 
Not to the degree that you're pushing this.


EDIT - and also the others, basically amplify the nature of the character.
 
not to the degree?


um...


red rage: your love of peace and life and puppies turns you into a ravening killer.


contempt of the virtuous: your infinite patience and fairness turns you into an impatient, intolerant, preachy, self-righteous bastard.
 
Just because you're a iron-willed monk with a super high tempermence doesn't mean you can't be a preachy bastard that is self-righteous and all that. You just look down on EVERYONE who can't be as good as you. Tempermence doesn't mean you're fairminded, just that you can resist temptations.


Red Rage of Compassion; you love EVERYTHING... But you see these, these people, these BASTARDS WHO KEEP HURTING EVERYTHING, EVERYONE. You NEED to do SOMETHING! and then you go ker-snap! It's so obvious, so CLEAR to you. People and things keep getting hurt because these BASTARDS are there to hurt them, what if... they're no longer there. Clearly you're a GOOD person, so you should HELP by REMOVING them.
 
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