Fandom A Song of Ice and Fire RP (Game of Thrones)

[Archon]

Stannis only had like 24k men at Blackwater Bay and still would have took the city despite


A) Losing several thousand to Wildfire


B) The Garrison being well-equipped Lannister soldiers and Goldcloaks


I don't see how the Stormlands could possibly lose horribly in this situation. Lose? Of course, but no way is it decisive. Pyrrhic at best.

 

[TheAncientCelt]

I can't wait for the Battle of the Stags. It's happening.

 

[Leusis]

Stannis only had like 24k men at Blackwater Bay and still would have took the city despite
A) Losing several thousand to Wildfire


B) The Garrison being well-equipped Lannister soldiers and Goldcloaks


I don't see how the Stormlands could possibly lose horribly in this situation. Lose? Of course, but no way is it decisive. Pyrrhic at best.

The garrison in the books was 3,000-4,000 strong at absolute best. This garrison is over twice that size, even a child could do damage to a sieging army with a pile of big rocks, being the defender during an assault on a walled city makes even the worst fighter useful.

 

[Archon]

The garrison in the books was 3,000-4,000 strong at absolute best. This garrison is over twice that size, even a child could do damage to a sieging army with a pile of big rocks, being the defender during an assault on a walled city makes even the worst fighter useful.

The problem is that advantage is lost the moment the beach is taken, and the walls are lost. Lannister soldiers could hold the beach, AND walls for significantly longer than the ill-disciplined, poorly-trained Goldcloaks. Whilst the Baratheon army will take significant losses during the initial assault, the moment that they enter a melee on the walls every Stormlander soldier is worth 2 Goldcloaks - by this point, how many would route?

 

[Mion]

Is there any posts I need to make?


If not I will start working on other posts.

 

[Leusis]

Heres the problem, you're assuming the stormlanders will continue the assault after losing half their army before their men even start getting on the walls. There is definitely a good chance that the Stormlanders just break before they even breach anything, something that happened a lot when armies didn't have 3 or more men for every 1 the defenders had.

 

[TheAncientCelt]

Is there any posts I need to make?
If not I will start working on other posts.

Bleh, i might be a while working on my reply. Unfortunately, I am just tired, laying about sounds better than typing.

 

[Mion]

Bleh, i might be a while working on my reply. Unfortunately, I am just tired, laying about sounds better than typing.

Thats perfectly fine, I have realised at this point most of you have more of a life than I do lmao.

 

[TheAncientCelt]

Thats perfectly fine, I have realised at this point most of you have more of a life than I do lmao.

You'd be surprised xD

 

[Archon]

Heres the problem, you're assuming the stormlanders will continue the assault after losing half their army before their men even start getting on the walls. There is definitely a good chance that the Stormlanders just break before they even breach anything, something that happened a lot when armies didn't have 3 or more men for every 1 the defenders had.

You're assuming the Baratheon army will lose nearly half it's men before reaching the walls? I'm no military expert, so this is an estimation for Centurion to make, but that seems ludicrous to me since we're saying they lose 12-13k men before even reaching the walls.


5-6k seems reasonable, but double?!

 

[TheAncientCelt]

You'd have to be an idiot to lose half your men in a siege. The whole point of sieges is that they are safe ways of defeating your opponents, as opposed to risking your men in open battle. If the Baratheon's rush things, maybe they'll find themselves hurting. But in a normal siege? They have a comfortable majority.

 

[Leusis]

You're assuming the Baratheon army will lose nearly half it's men before reaching the walls? I'm no military expert, so this is an estimation for Centurion to make, but that seems ludicrous to me since we're saying they lose 12-13k men before even reaching the walls.
5-6k seems reasonable, but double?!

First off, when I say reach the walls I mean the moment that men scale the walls and begin fighting the defenders on them. I'm also assuming since this whole siege thing is going to be rushed af that the Stormlanders won't be taking the time (months) it would take to properly prepare for an assault on the walls and gates. Giving the Stormlanders little prep beyond ladders and rams i'd say that 12,000 dying by the time they started storming the city/walls to be entirely accurate.

 

[Leusis]

You'd have to be an idiot to lose half your men in a siege. The whole point of sieges is that they are safe ways of defeating your opponents, as opposed to risking your men in open battle. If the Baratheon's rush things, maybe they'll find themselves hurting. But in a normal siege? They have a comfortable majority.

I'm talking about an assault on the walls, not you average siege. Because if they did what most people did, battle wouldn't even take place until months after they got there, if at all. I'm talking about him showing up and trying to storm the city by force.

 

[Elendithas]

Shit, if they actually decide to not have most of their men die in an immediate assault they could have to deal with a considerably larger force destroying them from the flank.

 

[TheAncientCelt]

If they storm the castle, obviously there will be heavy causalities. You're attacking a fortified position where you can only get so many men out at a time. But with the North and Riverlands supporting them, the Baratheon's can afford a long siege. Or wait till reinforcements arrive. Storming the city from two points would greatly alleviate the dangers presented to either army.

 

[Elendithas]

What may seem like a rash decision at the time could well mean the difference between taking the city and being surprised and ultimately killed. Then again, they wouldn't have the men to hold against an assault from the force I'm thinking of.

 

[Leusis]

I think the Stormlanders wouldn't forget the fact there are 20,000 levies just waiting to be raised all over the Crownlands. If even half of those forces were raised and attacked the Stormlanders while they were camped they'd be slaughtered by the flanking force and the 10,000 defenders charging out from the city.

 

[Archon]

I'm talking about an assault on the walls, not you average siege. Because if they did what most people did, battle wouldn't even take place until months after they got there, if at all. I'm talking about him showing up and trying to storm the city by force.

If they storm the castle, obviously there will be heavy causalities. You're attacking a fortified position where you can only get so many men out at a time. But with the North and Riverlands supporting them, the Baratheon's can afford a long siege. Or wait till reinforcements arrive. Storming the city from two points would greatly alleviate the dangers presented to either army.

What may seem like a rash decision at the time could well mean the difference between taking the city and being surprised and ultimately killed. Then again, they wouldn't have the men to hold against an assault from the force I'm thinking of.

They will be storming the city, but I was under the impression it was known to be an assault from two sides. With Braedon leading the front, and Rory attacking from the Blackwater. I don't see how they'd manage to lose 12,000 men before breaching the city either through the gates, or atop the walls.


@Hypnos Walder is currently apart of this, so the Baratheon's would be expecting a Riverland army to act as support once the castle is taken. The whole point of marching without the Riverland army is to stop the Crownland levies further reinforcing the capital.

 

[TheAncientCelt]

They won't lose 12,000 before they breach the city, not if they have a capable commander. But the causalities involved in the action of breaching the city may force the Baratheon's to stop any advances after the storming of the city, win or lose.


And I didn't know it'd be a too pronged assault.

 

[Leusis]

They will be storming the city, but I was under the impression it was known to be an assault from two sides. With Braedon leading the front, and Rory attacking from the Blackwater. I don't see how they'd manage to lose 12,000 men before breaching the city either through the gates, or atop the walls.
@Hypnos Walder is currently apart of this, so the Baratheon's would be expecting a Riverland army to act as support once the castle is taken. The whole point of marching without the Riverland army is to stop the Crownland levies further reinforcing the capital.

Well if Baelor decided to be loyal Rory's fleet could be defeated before they even joined the siege. So under the circumstances you're giving the crown could still pull out a very good victory. However this depends entirely on Baelor staying loyal and crushing Rory on the water. Basically Baelor gets to decide who wins the siege, if he chooses Kuvira he'll take Rory's position with no questions because his fleet was the thing that won the battle.

 

[Archon]

It'd be impossible to dig through, but I swear many pages ago when we were discussing a the Battle of King's Landing, I said Rory would be doing what Stannis did whilst Braedon marches on the front.

Well if Baelor decided to be loyal Rory's fleet could be defeated before they even joined the siege. So under the circumstances you're giving the crown could still pull out a very good victory. However this depends entirely on Baelor staying loyal and crushing Rory on the water. Basically Baelor gets to decide who wins the siege, if he chooses Kuvira he'll take Rory's position with no questions because his fleet was the thing that won the battle.

The majority of Baelor's Fleet is at Driftmark if I'm not mistaken, Rory should also have the - albeit a very temporary - element of surprise. Not to mention an extra small fleet of Pirate Vessels thanks to Davos Mandon.

 

[Elendithas]

But then Swain comes outta nowhere with a hundred cannons and single-handedly destroys the entire fleet!

 

[TheAncientCelt]

Inb4 Canon Euron Grejoy appears in the RP and takes down all your puny fleets.

 

[Archon]

To be honest, if we lose the siege somehow. I want to have my arc with Rory somehow go all Jaime/Tyrion by becoming a Prisoner of War or something, and I might even give an epic speech and demand trial by combat.

 

[TheAncientCelt]

To be honest, if we lose the siege somehow. I want to have my arc with Rory somehow go all Jaime/Tyrion by becoming a Prisoner of War or something, and I might even give an epic speech and demand trial by combat.

He might be able to get a fair trial. . If anyone but Kuvira is sitting on the throne. If she isn't around, I feel like others might see a Baratheon prisoner who has known disputes with the main family, as a valuable thing.