Dice Rifts - The Thirteenth Mystery - OOC

[Esbilon]

We're very much not part of the in-group, though. Tolkeen is everything the CS state hates and we're on their side all through the first war and at the onset of the second. In principle it might be possible to do a reasonable infiltration job this time around, but I don't think we have time for that - and again it's not necessarily the kind of RPG that'd be a lot of fun.

 

[Eonivar]

Yeah I did not know really what would make a difference here. I was just going to make a personal backstory for my character and have her manage her own agenda and if she gets swept up to make some major change in the time line, great.

 

[EmperorNorton1]

alright. sorry, I dont often get a chance to talk about that stuff, i got over excited. I want what is best for the rp, and i want you guys to make charictars you'll find fun. regicide is an option, but not necessarily the one we'll choose, and all I say is just a sugestion. since that isnt what you want, that's fine with me. i just want us all to have fun.

 

[Eonivar]

EmperorNorton1

You are fine, I have dual degrees in history and political science. What you have been talking about is very interesting to me.

I do not think we have enough time to effect a change through propaganda and long term political maneuvering. The first war will be starting soon after our characters reawaken.

Also I do not think there is any sympathetic political faction within the Coalition. The leaders are all fascist assholes. (For some reason the last couple of seasons of Peaky Blinders come to mind here) but I do not think that even Tommy Shelby would be able to get in good with the Proseks to try and cut the head off of the snake.

 

[EmperorNorton1]

the thing with the Fascist snake is that it seems to eat its own tail. We have to try and prevent this war. We do know that there is going to be the assassination attempt with the federation of magic. we could foil the plot to get in good with the fascists, or we could assist the would-be killers. but stopping the war will be our main goal. after all, we all died in the war, or were about to, when we got yoinked back into time. (very proper terminology)

 

[EmperorNorton1]

also somehow i only just realized- death camps. the CS has death camps. wow. uh. shit. these guys arent just fascists anymore. they're Actual Goddamn Nazis. as a Jew- i mean i was expecting that it would be genocide, but i was expecting more of a "mob violence and pogroms" deal, a la the russian empire. no, Actual Goddamn Nazis.

 

[Esbilon]

Rifts is not from the era of subtle storytelling.

 

[EmperorNorton1]

no. no it most certainly is not. i may need to put my head down for a moment. this is a lot. I am even more invested in this game now. fuck nazis.

 

[Eonivar]

Unfortunately I think the best chance to stop the war would have been preventing Creed to be appointed to King early on as he had it out for the Coalition to begin with and basic pushed for the war indirectly with his speeches and starting up the Tolkien war machine. If we killed Creed at the point of reawakening he will just be a martyr. So no matter what the Coaltion will see Tolkeen as a threat with its built up army. Otherwise without Creed Tolkeen would have just been yet another magic settlement out in the frontier and not seen as a threat.

 

[Esbilon]

Unfortunately I think the best chance to stop the war would have been preventing Creed to be appointed to King early on as he had it out for the Coalition to begin with and basic pushed for the war indirectly with his speeches and starting up the Tolkien war machine. If we killed Creed at the point of reawakening he will just be a martyr. So no matter what the Coaltion will see Tolkeen as a threat with its built up army. Otherwise without Creed Tolkeen would have just been yet another magic settlement out in the frontier and not seen as a threat.

I disagree with this analysis. The Coalition State is always going to become a problem if left to its own devices. Tolkeen may be able to Switzerland it out if they play their hand differently, but I doubt it. It's such a haven for magic and D-Bees that there's just no scenario where they're not at the butt of CS propaganda.

 

[Eonivar]

I disagree with this analysis. The Coalition State is always going to become a problem if left to its own devices. Tolkeen may be able to Switzerland it out if they play their hand differently, but I doubt it. It's such a haven for magic and D-Bees that there's just no scenario where they're not at the butt of CS propaganda.

Probably so. It almost plays out as a no win scenario here. After Tolkien falls then the Federation? Dweomer? New Lazlo? Lazlo?

I know Kevin was looking for an epic post apocalyptic story here but I do not see a good ending for any of these settlements after Tolkeen, and the only way the Coalition falls is from within. To directly oppose the Coaltion you would need a large nation with considerable firepower that is essentially good, which does not really exist on Rifts Earth.

The Splugorth are probably the closest entity in power that could take down the Coalition in a direct conflict. But they are really not any better.

 

[EmperorNorton1]

we'd need to pull an allied powers. tolkien would have to ally itself with everyone it can get to. contact the federation, contact the other nations you mentioned, and even then, we'd need an espionage network to help CS crumble from within. its going to be tough. but even then, world war two lead to the deaths of some sixty million people. this could potentialy wipe off all life from the continent. hopefuly, no one has nukes. but still, a major war will lead to major depopulation.

our only hope is the fall of the CS. we cant let the federation make the kid into a martyr. maybe, if we can sneak into the death camps, publish information of the horrors within, show them to potential allies to encourage them to join us, show them to the people of the CS "your emperor is slaughtering not only non-humans, but also to the same humans the emperor has sworn to protect." there were P.O.W.s and Political dissidents, along with priests, in the camps. stands to reason dissedents would be sent to camps in this universe too.

 

[Esbilon]

Trying to tell fascists that dissidents are people is probably not an easy sell.

Also, we should remember that even though they lost the war canonically, Tolkeen's leadership are not idiots. We should maybe be on the look out for things where a small group of people with foreknowledge can make a difference rather than general methods for fighting a powerful fascist state.

 

[EmperorNorton1]

if we'd be willing to bend our morals, the assassination attempt by the federation. we could prevent it from happening, saving the life of the son and protecting the queen. we do that, the fascist fucks will love us. and then, because we are "defenders of humanity",acording to the very own words of the emperor, we incite revolution.

the people themselves arent true fascists. most of them, if they were educated, wouldnt choose the ideology of hate. hate is what they have been taught, and mob mentality is a powerful thing. they are human, they'll feel pity. no doubt, the sight of children, who have managed small amounts of psychic powers, being shot by soldiers, or gassed, will make them hesitate. you don't choose that mutation, children cant choose that mutation, and people love children.

 

[Epiphany]

In regards to the coalition as Nazis, the original core book way back in the early '90s revealed that the current emperor, as a young man, discovered Hitler's writings in the Chi-Town libraries and became enamored with it. Without any context for what happened to Hitler or what he did. So yes, the fascist Coalition as Nazis is pretty intentional.

That said, even the Coalition is more than a monolithic political philosophy. I'd have to reread the histories but I think about 60 or 70 years ago is when the use of magic was outlawed, prior to then it was an endorsed part of the military and government. There is a secret group called the Vanguard who are the remnants of that order, still trying to help the Coalition's people while avoiding detection.

Additionally, the second coalition wars book makes it clear that there are differences in ideology within the coalition government and within its military, including the military high command. The text says a large number were horrified at the use of death camps or genocide at all. Arguably the closest thing to a liberal, reasonable faction in the coalition still doesn't like DBs, they just want them living somewhere else. They are ultimately overridden by the emperor. And by 109 P.A. they've largely vanished due to the Coalition's success in Tolkeen.

I'm not trying to steer you guys, I just want you to know a little context and that trying to 'reason' with the Coalition as a whole, or just get rid of select leaders, isn't as entirely unfeasible as it might sound.

 

[Epiphany]

if we'd be willing to bend our morals, the assassination attempt by the federation. we could prevent it from happening, saving the life of the son and protecting the queen. we do that, the fascist fucks will love us. and then, because we are "defenders of humanity",acording to the very own words of the emperor, we incite revolution.

the people themselves arent true fascists. most of them, if they were educated, wouldnt choose the ideology of hate. hate is what they have been taught, and mob mentality is a powerful thing. they are human, they'll feel pity. no doubt, the sight of children, who have managed small amounts of psychic powers, being shot by soldiers, or gassed, will make them hesitate. you don't choose that mutation, children cant choose that mutation, and people love children.

What your characters would probably know (and some might know more depending on what your backstory is) is that Lady Prosek is believed to be more sympathetic, less warlike. When she was rescued, she largely disappeared from public view over the last 4 years of the future (105-109 P.A.). It's commonly believed her retreat from public life is due to her advocation of "unpopular" political views like ending the death camps and stopping the war.

How much of that is true, or how much of that might be because of the circumstances of her rescue, is hard to say.

Unless of course your character had a hand in her rescue 4 years ago, 4 years from now...

 

[Epiphany]

Unfortunately I think the best chance to stop the war would have been preventing Creed to be appointed to King early on as he had it out for the Coalition to begin with and basic pushed for the war indirectly with his speeches and starting up the Tolkien war machine. If we killed Creed at the point of reawakening he will just be a martyr. So no matter what the Coaltion will see Tolkeen as a threat with its built up army. Otherwise without Creed Tolkeen would have just been yet another magic settlement out in the frontier and not seen as a threat.

While I'm not advocating for regicide, in 101 P.A. King Creed has a couple of other members of the Council expressly backing his bid for arming the nation. Warlord Corin Scard in particular. The majority don't want a war, they just don't see a lot of other options.

Except for Erin Tarn. In about four years, the famed writer and anthropologist who has traveled the world will try one last time to talk King Creed out of this path (as he was a student of hers once upon a time). You can read the dialogue exchange in Coalition Wars 1 - Sedition, pgs. 90-93. In particular, her recommendation will have been (will be, was, tenses get complicated with time travel) for Tolkeen as a nation to just leave. Flee westward as that part of the New Frontier is largely unpopulated. Flee and allow the Coalition States to move into Minnesota where the Xiticix Territory to the north will then be the Coalition's problem instead of theirs.

It's a possible future that was not realized in the future your characters lived through. Yet another option to consider.

Again, I'm doing my best not to advocate for a course of action. I just want you guys to have all the information that I have when it comes to deciding how you OCCly want to approach the game.

 

[EmperorNorton1]

ahh, Erin Tarn, the emma goldman of this universe. we love her.

 

[Eonivar]

Again, I'm doing my best not to advocate for a course of action. I just want you guys to have all the information that I have when it comes to deciding how you OCCly want to approach the game.

Yeah that is what I am trying to get my head around, the scope of the game seems a bit daunting and I am not sure where to really go or how my character would affect change.

My character idea is this. This is just a thought, nothing set in stone, I am happy to adjust it to fit in the story.

My Psi-Ghost started off as a bit of a mercenary as most of her people are. She came to Tolkeen to receive a job not long before the speech occurs, in taking the the job so she falls in love with someone important there (not sure who, another woman, maybe one of the female council members) and decided to stay and work for them. She ended up marrying this person maybe halfway the through the war, and her final memory will be sitting over her wife’s dead body as the coalition overrun them.

So she will have to question herself if she would want to go through this moment in her life again with trying to make changes or forge a different path.

That is my idea for my character backstory. I am open to ideas and suggestions or adjustments. I kind of like her being connected to one of the council. If the idea will not work for this story that is fine, and I can brainstorm something else.

 

[Epiphany]

we'd need to pull an allied powers. tolkien would have to ally itself with everyone it can get to. contact the federation, contact the other nations you mentioned, and even then, we'd need an espionage network to help CS crumble from within. its going to be tough. but even then, world war two lead to the deaths of some sixty million people. this could potentialy wipe off all life from the continent. hopefuly, no one has nukes. but still, a major war will lead to major depopulation.

our only hope is the fall of the CS. we cant let the federation make the kid into a martyr. maybe, if we can sneak into the death camps, publish information of the horrors within, show them to potential allies to encourage them to join us, show them to the people of the CS "your emperor is slaughtering not only non-humans, but also to the same humans the emperor has sworn to protect." there were P.O.W.s and Political dissidents, along with priests, in the camps. stands to reason dissedents would be sent to camps in this universe too.

The Coalition States are the only known power in North America with nuclear bombs. There are a few other kingdoms (Northern Gun, Manistique Imperium for example) that have nuclear reactor technology though. But the CS is the only one using nukes. They actually will try nukes in a few years, trying to just wipe Tolkeen out from long range. Their salvo is largely intercepted and destroyed and the ones that get through impact against an unseen-until-then magical defensive shield that wards the entire Tri-City region and 'eats' the nuclear blast.

It's the main reason the Coalition is approaching the invasion the way they do; their more 'decisive' strategy failed.

Also bear in mind, the Death Camps don't exist yet. They won't exist at all until 106 P.A. and won't be in active use until 107 P.A. That said, Death Camp-like operations are probably in use in CS controlled territory. Their architect is General Micander Drogue, the man who effectively took over the Tolkeen invasion in its second year of operation, by advocating for the use of Death Camps which he'd presumably already seen in operation (or administered himself). His chief lieutenants are/were Lieutenant General Nikoto Galva and Lieutenant General Kira Moss. By 109 P.A. he's well known enough among Tolkeen's forces that the average PC has heard of him and his 'alliance' of like-minded individuals who dominate the Coalition military thinking towards the end.

In 101 P.A., Drogue is still a Captain and he's principally involved in handling mini-campaigns against the Pecos Empire and the Federation of Magic, on the Coalition's southern and eastern borders.

 

[Epiphany]

Yeah that is what I am trying to get my head around, the scope of the game seems a bit daunting and I am not sure where to really go or how my character would affect change.

My character idea is this. This is just a thought, nothing set in stone, I am happy to adjust it to fit in the story.

My Psi-Ghost started off as a bit of a mercenary as most of her people are. She came to Tolkeen to receive a job not long before the speech occurs, in taking the the job so she falls in love with someone important there (not sure who, another woman, maybe one of the female council members) and decided to stay and work for them. She ended up marrying this person maybe halfway the through the war, and her final memory will be sitting over her wife’s dead body as the coalition overrun them.

So she will have to question herself if she would want to go through this moment in her life again with trying to make changes or forge a different path.

That is my idea for my character backstory. I am open to ideas and suggestions or adjustments. I kind of like her being connected to one of the council. If the idea will not work for this story that is fine, and I can brainstorm something else.

Easy options are:

• Mida Elektis is one of three women in the Circle. She is a 12th level Earth & Fire Warlock with a keen sense of the world and elements around her.
• Anya Svetska, rogue Mystic Kuznya from Russia and chief engineer of Tolkeen's city defenses whose pure warrior mettle has earned her the respect of all Tolkeenites.
• Glorissa Trenshire, Conjurer and the ultimate guerrilla warrior whose experience fighting in the 'Burbs gave her the skills to make the Coalition's invasion of Tolkeen a costly one.

 

[Epiphany]

Bear in mind, your characters are about 5th level in terms of their 'careers' now, in 101 P.A.
They'll be around 8th to 10th level in terms of field experience from the Coalition Wars by 109 P.A.
General Micander Drogue is a 10th level Technical Officer by 107 P.A. or so and is probably a 6th or 7th level Technical Officer now, in the past.

In other words, you can play the mercenary off the street if you want but you can also play characters who may have somewhat important jobs now and who will have very important jobs by the war's end.

 

[EmperorNorton1]

My Psi-Ghost started off as a bit of a mercenary as most of her people are. She came to Tolkeen to receive a job not long before the speech occurs, in taking the the job so she falls in love with someone important there (not sure who, another woman, maybe one of the female council members) and decided to stay and work for them. She ended up marrying this person maybe halfway the through the war, and her final memory will be sitting over her wife’s dead body as the coalition overrun them.

thats tragic and awful and i had a similar idea for my dumbass, at least with the wife thing. I have a backup, and wow, our guys are gonna be so messed up when the rift takes them.

 

[Eonivar]

Epiphany Question, I thought I read somewhere that the Council survived the final onslaught? Is this true?

 

[Epiphany]

Epiphany Question, I thought I read somewhere that the Council survived the final onslaught? Is this true?

From your character's point of view, all of the Council are likely still alive (unless it's dramatically useful for one or more to perish in the final siege, depending on your backstory). The Coalition has invaded Tolkeen, broken the walls in multiple places and has thousands of troops in the city interior. None of the technomagical infrastructure still works. Defeat is already certain, individual PCs are still in the fight because there's no other choice, because you're buying time for civilians to evacuate to the west or because you're determined to take as many Coalition soldiers down with you as possible.

In short, the ultimate fate of the Council as a whole is uncertain, as you all vanished into a Rift-driven temporal distortion that has dropped you 8 years in the past before the Aftermath.