Keychain #301-305

Perhaps Misho is just uncomfortable with casual sex? Maybe he has Dresden Syndrome, named after Harry Dresden, who remains celibate for multiple books, not because there's no one available, but just because he's not comfortable with being in a non-committed relationship. Given Marena's... appetites, I imagine it would be next to impossible to get her into a committed relationship, (see the "Monogamy is weak!" page,) and so Misho just isn't interested.
 
If we go by the Solar Bond theory...


Misho remembers his 1st Age self and relationships. At that time wasn't the Lunar shown with him always male? Maybe Misho and this Lunar were the best of buddies (or lovers) and now he is having trouble resolving his guy friendship with the hot girl who wants to get into his pants. So he maintains his friendship on his own terms rather than try to advance into something new with Marena.


Which makes me wonder if Marena's appetites aren't in someway a reaction to Misho to provoke him. Its not out of bounds if you consider that Marena supposedly had a stable family life with her husband and chilcren before. In a relationship she might not cat around. The Solar Bond prevents her from 'moving on' as well.
 
I'm pretty sure its been established that Marena's Limit Break is Curse of the Mother Hen (see here and here). There's lots of other hints too, like her glee in dressing up Secret. It seems unlikely to me that Jukashi would give her a houseruled limit break.


(For those who don't know, the Curse of the Mother Hen makes you treat everyone around you as if they were helpless and unable to take care of themselves, basically as though they were your own two year old children. And partial control is just doing this to people you know. The full limit break has you doing this to everyone. Marena's limit break should be a sight to see.)


Its more likely that estrus + Solar Bond = this conversation once a year. And that Misho turns her down each year because this conversation only happens once a year. He doesn't want to just have casual sex with Marena. And besides, it's a bit like taking advantage of someone who is drunk; she's not exactly in full control of her facilities right now. While Marena herself perhaps wouldn't mind, Misho would.


My theory (for which, mind you, I have absolutely no evidence as backup) is that Marena is the reincarnation of Misho's wife (we know he had a child, and given his personality it would be weirder if he wasn't married). Which from Misho's point of view is like waking up from a long sleep to learn that the person you've been married to for several millennia is now someone completely different. Which leads to awkwardness. He has feelings for Marena, but at least a part of them is him projecting his feelings for his long-dead wife. And he knows this, which makes it worse. Marena, meanwhile, has feelings for him too, but she's not the sort to get tied down, Solar Bond or no Solar Bond. Misho knows this, too, and accepts it. But that doesn't mean he likes it (see here and his expression in panel 10 here, which says a lot).


Still, Misho would rather be just friends than only have a casual relationship with her. And then once a year Marena goes into heat and starts looking for a mate, and a combination of proximity, familiarity, compatibility and the Bond mean that Misho is the obvious choice. Which is like dangling a carrot in front of someone who would like a full meal, thank you very much.


So yeah. Awkward.


Of course this is all just conjecture, so naturally Jukashi will confirm that I am right in every particular.


And on a different note, I'm new. Hello everyone. Its nice to finally stop lurking and actually take part in the conversation.
 
I think Skycroft put it very well and it don't think I could state it better. Though I'm still holding out hope that Marena is actually Secret's Lunar mate for numerous reasons. Misho's relationship with Marena could simply be close friendship and familiarity and Skycroft's evaluation of Misho's feelings would remain. The Lunar Bond could explain Secret's mysterious lack of village-killing levels of resonance while also making her even more cute. Of course the errata on Resonance and Lunar Mates came out way after Keychain started so I'm definitely wrong at least about Jukashi's original intent for "who's Marena's bond?". But I can still hope. I love the dynamic between Misho and Marena and I don't think you need a Solar Bond there to explain it.
 
josiah42 said:
I love the dynamic between Misho and Marena and I don't think you need a Solar Bond there to explain it.
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Oh totally. That's why I said I have no evidence. It's just speculation.
 
Aasharu said:
Perhaps Misho is just uncomfortable with casual sex? Maybe he has Dresden Syndrome, named after Harry Dresden, who remains celibate for multiple books, not because there's no one available, but just because he's not comfortable with being in a non-committed relationship. Given Marena's... appetites, I imagine it would be next to impossible to get her into a committed relationship, (see the "Monogamy is weak!" page,) and so Misho just isn't interested.
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This is what I thought as well (Agreeing with what a lot of other people have said too, but anyway). Mind you, I thought Marena was the one rejecting Misho because she didn't want more than a casual relationship, but thinking about it, this could easily work both ways.


I don't think this necessarily would have to have anything to do with a Solar bond, though. From what I can tell, Marena was hardly celibate before she met Misho...


I also notice that while Marena is angry at Misho for not having sex with her, she's being perfectly kind towards Secret.


We know what you're implying, Jukashi! We can see through your schemes!

Skycroft said:
I'm pretty sure its been established that Marena's Limit Break is Curse of the Mother Hen (see here and here).
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If I recall correctly, Jukashi stated somewhere that the latter comic isn't supposed to be an example of her Limit Break, which to me would seem to imply that hers isn't Curse of the Mother Hen... though, that would seem a little odd.
 
Hmmm... Maybe Misho rejects Marena when she's on heat, because Marena turned him down when she wasn't. They agreed to be friends, and it's Misho's job to remember it when That Time of the Year comes round again.
 
Skycroft said:
I'm pretty sure its been established that Marena's Limit Break is Curse of the Mother Hen (see here and here).
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If I recall correctly, Jukashi stated somewhere that the latter comic isn't supposed to be an example of her Limit Break, which to me would seem to imply that hers isn't Curse of the Mother Hen... though, that would seem a little odd.
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Jukashi stated that it wasn't an example of her Limit Break because she wasn't in Limit Break. She was engaged in behavior similar to her Limit Break, hence Misho's dry comment about it being "full moon already?" (incidentally, Jukashi also stated that it wasn't actually full moon). Similarly, Misho is behaving like his Limit Break here, but isn't actually Limit Breaking.


Jukashi apparently subscribes to the school of thought that the Great Curse affects a person's personality in more ways than just the Limit Break itself, or rather that it simply seems like part of a person's normal personality. The Limit Break itself is what happens when this seemingly normal personality quirk impedes normal functioning or rational thought (breaking into tears in the middle of a battle, for instance). I feel that in a narrative this works far better than a Limit Break that is completely at odds with the characters regular personality. Even in a game, I would call that bad roleplaying.


There are other examples of that sort of thing. For example, the Great Curse is forcing Nemen Yi's actions in panel 8 here, but she isn't actually going full on Flawed Fate (I think).


Note that in the comic I gave Marena is only mothering Misho. As I stated earlier, if she was actually Limit Breaking she would be mothering everyone.


Edit: If I recall correctly, Jukashi's exact words were " If she Limit Breaks, you'll know". Like I said, something to see.
 
I have to agree with that opinion- Limit Break for me is always linked to an aspect of the character's personality. A lot of the time when making characters, there's no doubt at all about which Break they're going to have.


'Course, there's always the subtle option of having their Great Curse expression being opposite to the linked personality aspect- a careful, self-controlling Eclipse diplomat who conciously avoids temptation might, on hitting Limit 10, go "Sod it" and start hitting all the kinds of vice he's been offered and rejected.


So yes, that does seem to be evidence, despite not being full Limit Break.
 
Re: Marena x Misho: Marena's a whore, and Misho's shown on more than one occasion that he tries to be a moral, upstanding citizen. We don't know a lot about Misho's previous life(s), so perhaps in addition to not having sex with a pro bono hooker, he's trying to maintain a monogamous lifestyle.
 
*laughs*


Oh, wow. And here I was thinking they had unresolved sexual tension. I can't wait to see Misho's excuse for refusing lunar sex.


Looking back, I don't know why I this surprised me. Marena's fairly open about her desires. Although this gives me the mental image of Marena asking if turning into a man would interest him and Misho being weirded out.
 
My hypothesis is this:


During her heat period, Marena is desperate to get with someone. Who is always around her, is a kind, considerate and all around great guy? Misho. So during her heat period, she tries to sleep with him, which he always turns down.


As can be seen here, they have an agreement, which implies that Marena is sensible and respects Misho's stance most of the time (it's not like she has no other options). During her heat, however, she gets... pushy. No doubt Misho is familiar with this. I'm personally rooting for Marena and Misho having a relationship based on friendship.


Misho's reason for turning Marena down can be manifold. I am personally of the opinion that he, having only the Thirce-Radiant's memories and none of his own, still consider sleeping with others to be adultery towards his late wife. Look at the 5th panel above; he seems a bit wistful as he says the part about the agreement. I find this to imply that Misho is attracted to Marena (as most straight men would be), but he doesn't let that take precedence over his obligations towards his wife.
 
Marena's a whore
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Oh, no, not a whore! She'd be dreadfully annoyed about being called that.


She would insist on being called a courtesan, and go on to explain that it's a class consideration, like the difference between a five-star chef and a burger flipper at macdonalds.


It's like how you couldn't call an Exalt a gold digger. They'd be an orichalcum excavator.
 
Jukashi said:
Marena's a whore
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Oh, no, not a whore! She'd be dreadfully annoyed about being called that.


She would insist on being called a courtesan, and go on to explain that it's a class consideration, like the difference between a five-star chef and a burger flipper at macdonalds.


It's like how you couldn't call an Exalt a gold digger. They'd be an orichalcum excavator.
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So, Inara Serra with foxgirl ears, a fox tail, shapeshifting and the ability to hurl bits of masonry around with annoying force; with the slight chance of turning into a violent maniacial nine-foot-tall werefox of the apocalypse?
 
Misho remembers his 1st Age self and relationships. At that time wasn't the Lunar shown with him always male? Maybe Misho and this Lunar were the best of buddies (or lovers) and now he is having trouble resolving his guy friendship with the hot girl who wants to get into his pants.
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Except Marena can turn into a man.
 
Notsteve said:
Misho remembers his 1st Age self and relationships. At that time wasn't the Lunar shown with him always male? Maybe Misho and this Lunar were the best of buddies (or lovers) and now he is having trouble resolving his guy friendship with the hot girl who wants to get into his pants.
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Except Marena can turn into a man.
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Still doesn't help, necessarily. Misho knows she's naturally a woman, plus there's no way she's getting her First Age incarnation's heart's blood, so even then she couldn't be the same man. If Twin-Faced Hero was really a cure-all for all Solar hangups about the gender of their mates, we wouldn't have the Leviathan we know and fear today.
 
Skycroft said:
Skycroft said:
I'm pretty sure its been established that Marena's Limit Break is Curse of the Mother Hen (see here and here).
Click to expand...
If I recall correctly, Jukashi stated somewhere that the latter comic isn't supposed to be an example of her Limit Break, which to me would seem to imply that hers isn't Curse of the Mother Hen... though, that would seem a little odd.
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Jukashi stated that it wasn't an example of her Limit Break because she wasn't in Limit Break. She was engaged in behavior similar to her Limit Break, hence Misho's dry comment about it being "full moon already?" (incidentally, Jukashi also stated that it wasn't actually full moon). Similarly, Misho is behaving like his Limit Break here, but isn't actually Limit Breaking.
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...Maybe I misunderstood what was said. That does make sense, and I do have trouble imagining Marena as having a different Limit Break, unless it's one not listed in the core Lunar book. Curse of the Drunken Monkey is the only other I can see applying to her, except that would require Temperance to be her primary Virtue...
 
Jukashi said:
Marena's a whore
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Oh, no, not a whore! She'd be dreadfully annoyed about being called that.


She would insist on being called a courtesan, and go on to explain that it's a class consideration, like the difference between a five-star chef and a burger flipper at macdonalds.


It's like how you couldn't call an Exalt a gold digger. They'd be an orichalcum excavator.
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True, she's the daughter of Realm nobility and a Goddess, she's got some class.


Among other things.
 
Wasn't Karen Marena's Solar/Lunar bond? Which was why Marena could "feel" Karen in the Nova chapter?


The bond doesn't have to be a romantic one, y'know. It could just be very strong feelings of kinship and brotherhood.
 
Sanguine said:
Fighteer said:
What forms do Lunar Limit Breaks take anyway? I have next to zero knowledge.
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Same to the way a Solar's works, with the exception that when they're first struck by the full moon's light they gain limit as if she resisted acting on her primary virtue. It's also seen as a natural part of being a Lunar (as a gift from Luna, given how limit breaking feels very nice). They even have gatherings on the night of the full moon to induce the limit break... And then have an orgy of limit break (featured in this very comic, page 187, panel 2).


Compassion limit breaks are seen with stigma though.
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Wrong, it is instead of a Limit Condition. Lunars still gain limit from suppressing their primary Virtue.
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Just read the book, and so it is. Teaches me for going by my swiss cheese memory.
 
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