Solar Dodge

[MOK]

Grrrrrrrreetings.


Yes, roll the R.  No, theres no reason.


I would like the input of those that dwell here:


I wanted to throw a custom charm on my Dodgemaster McDodgefag Solar Exalt, who has taken all the canon dodge charms.  However, since he's not so strong on parrying, I'd like him to be even MORE... uh... dodgy.


Dodge.


So in trying to dodge think of more dodge possibilities he could dodge, one of the first dodge mechanics to dodge to mind was a dodgoubler Doubler.  Seeing as how we've seendodge success doublers elsedodge in the Solar charmsets.  Dodge.  It seemed pretty basic and intuidodge, but then again, there arent that many examples around for me to dodge sure.


So I formulated this dodgerpiece.


Flexing Darkness Evasion


    Cost: 2 motes


    Duration: Instant


    Type: Supplemental


    Minimum Dodge: 5


    Minimum Essence: 2


    Prerequisite Charms: Seven Shadow Evasion


    By suffusing his Anima with a surge of essence, the Exalt's movements are lent extreme pronunciation.  With the essence pushing his ability to the limits of reality, every leap and sidestep takes a clearly supernatural speed, even appearing as a blurred sequence of poses without movement.


    This charm may be invoked after an attack against the character is rolled.  For the next dodge roll, all total successes are doubled.


But theres the things I'm unsure of:  


One) would there be some other speedbump in the way, as this is a very powerful charm?  


Two) would it be less direct, ala Hungry Tiger, which doubles extra successes?  Or would there be some extra limitation imposed?


Three) since this doubles more dice, that raises the value of the charm mote-wise, however since its defense, it demotes the cost as well - is this cost appropriate?  2 motes is cheap, but would it be worthwhile at 3 motes?  You gotta compare it to the potential gain from charms like Reed in the Wind after all...


Four) Essence 2?  Melee accomplishes it at Essence 1... Yet cost vs potential seems damn fuzzy to me.


My goal is always to get my charms as close to canon scaling as possible, so your expert wreckingball opinions are what I seek here.


Further:  How would other abilities react to a success doubler?  Honestly I'd like to see more of them around.  I wonder, for instance, how would Thrown, Presence, Resistance, etc pull these off?  Mechanically, how would they be different?


Thank you come again,


MOK


Dodge.


(edit)  You'll not foil me, forum!  I will have my indentations!  I will kill him!!

 

[Joseph]

This Charm would cost more than 2 motes, honestly.  Probably more like 4, given its fairly massive utility.  


And that, really, is the problem with Charms like this in Solar Dodge.  You quickly reach the point where Dodge Charms are useless, because Seven Shadow Evasion (an Essence ONE Charm) does the job just fine.  You'll almost always either be completely fine with Flow Like Blood's reflexive dodge, or you'll want to Seven Shadow Evasion, because taking chances when you're a dodge monkey is a good way to die.


What I'd do is make this Charm have Shadow Over Water as a prerequisite, but have it ITSELF be a speed bump for an actually useful Charm that costs, say, 10 motes and 1 willpower, but doubles your dodge successes for the entire Scene, thus empowering your Flow Like Blood and making it more overall reliable without having to waste your Charm for the turn to do it.


Another possible example is a permanent type Charm that made the Solar much harder to hit constantly due to naturally twisting and turning to minimize the chance of being hit without ever really thinking about it.  Each purchase would permanently increase the difficulty to hit him by 1, up to a maximum of his dodge score, making it like Ox Body for dodge.  


A Seven Shadow Evasion that dodges the undodgable is another good one (will cost a willpower), and perhaps a follow up at Essence 4 that perfectly dodges all attacks for a single turn (if Bottomless Depths could perfectly soak for a single turn, Solar dodge can sure as fuck perfectly dodge it all for a single turn), and a follow up at Essence 5 that works like Protection of Celestial Bliss for dodges.

 

[MOK]

That line of thought, with the scene long, is actually one I persued not far in the past.  I already formulated a followup for that success doubler as a scene long, glorying in the possibilities.  When I showed it to my circle, I was shouted down as they peed their pants, and was beaten with rulers and fish.


I'm still washing the smell off.


Really they didn't tell me it was no good, just that it would work to throw the powerscale of combat sessions out of whack...  Which is true...  But as we know, Exalted is er... whats the word?  oh yeah.  CRAZY.


You raised a really good point concerning 7SE...  not worth the risk, and it's not exceedingly expensive.  And since we're on the topic, I brought this up in another forum:


The difference between 7SE and HGD is that one is perfect, and the others MORE perfect.  they're like a half-step off from each other.  That, and the costs - 7SE does not require willpower.  This made me figure, then, that a followup charm shouldn't ape HGD.  Thatd be shortselling dodge.  To keep the pace of the charms up, I figured the followup should be a 'half-step' better than HGD...


But how do you pull that off?  Finding an inbetween for PoCB and HGD is kinda ...  Hard.  I guess you can find little tweaks to the numbers, but how long it lasts, how much it costs, and how much prereq it needs seems incredibly fuzzy.  What do you think, Joe?


This was the version I came up with earlier, but others thought it was too powerful, given the comparison to PoCB


Heavenly Mists Evasion


      Cost:  4 motes, 1 Willpower


      Duration: One Turn


      Type: Reflexive


      Minimum Dodge: 5


      Minimum Essence: 4


      Prerequisite Charms:  Seven Shadow Evasion, Flow Like Blood


      With the power of this charm, an Exalts attunement with the ambient essence allows minute motes of his form to evade for a few moments while the rest of his form may remain intact until the magic of this charm has run its course.  While this charm is active, the character appears translucent and smokey, his form a living mist itself.


      The character may use this charm to evade, without his player rolling, any number of attacks against him, wether aware of them or not, during the turn of it's activation.  These attacks may be dodged even if the attack is not normally dodgeable, such as that from a swarm of diamond bees, or a tidal wave of lava.  This charm may only be activated, however, against an attack that the character anticipates - Its effects cannot be used as a form of Reflex Sidestep Technique.


While I'm at it, Id appreciate your(or anyone else') take on that persistant doubler too.  How do you view this charm in terms of tuning?


Peerless Motion Prana


      Cost: 5 motes, 1 willpower


      Duration: Scene


      Type: Supplemental


      Minimum Dodge: 5


      Minimum Essence: 3


      Prerequisite Charms: Flexing Darkness Evasion


      When an Exalt enacts this powerful technique, a disk of golden light surrounds their body, visible for but a fleeting moment.  This radius of patterned anima feeds into the Exalt as he moves, granting him the pervasiveness of the Unconquered Sun himself, everywhere and nowhere - Creating and being the incarnate of all light and shadow.


      This charm may be invoked after an attack against the character is rolled.  For the rest of the scene, all of the Exalt's total successes are doubled.


Helloooo derail...  I'll just change the thread name and deal with other doublers some other time, though this does provide some insight still...

 

[MOK]

waitwait i fucked it up.  PoCB makes your melee in blocks, when I was thinking scene length...  this kinda outdoes that.  I forgot about that.  Well, either way, the question stands:  what the heck would be balanced for its percieved appropriate pre-req placement?

 

[Joseph]

Really they didn't tell me it was no good, just that it would work to throw the powerscale of combat sessions out of whack...  Which is true...  But as we know, Exalted is er... whats the word?  oh yeah.  CRAZY.

ANY useful Dodge Charms are going to do that.  There's only so much you can increase your dodging capabilities before you're just plain not getting hit with any frequency, and the Dodge Charms in the core book pretty much skirt that boarder.  Just about any useful addition is going to push you into "virtually unhittable," so you might as well get them to accept that and move on with your lives.

You raised a really good point concerning 7SE...  not worth the risk, and it's not exceedingly expensive.  And since we're on the topic, I brought this up in another forum:
The difference between 7SE and HGD is that one is perfect, and the others MORE perfect.  they're like a half-step off from each other.  That, and the costs - 7SE does not require willpower.  This made me figure, then, that a followup charm shouldn't ape HGD.  Thatd be shortselling dodge.  To keep the pace of the charms up, I figured the followup should be a 'half-step' better than HGD...


But how do you pull that off?  

You can't, Heavenly Guardian Defense is as good as a single defensive action can get.  Well, I should rephrase that: it's as good as a single defensive action that requires you to hold a weapon will get.  A HGD style dodge would still be slightly better, simply because it requires no weapon.  But, since disarming is so hard, and Exalts almost always have SOME weapon availible, the difference would be negligible.  HGD can't be topped for a single defense against an attack.

Finding an inbetween for PoCB and HGD is kinda ...  Hard.  I guess you can find little tweaks to the numbers, but how long it lasts, how much it costs, and how much prereq it needs seems incredibly fuzzy.  What do you think, Joe?

The closest I can think of is a Charm that allowed you to perfectly dodge all attacks -- even undodgable attacks -- for a single turn.  This is clearly better than Heavenly Guardian Defense, but it's inferior to Protection of Celestial Bliss, because it must be actually used on the turn you'll be dodging on, and can't be Comboed, thus precludes any other Charms being used.  You can use Protection of Celestial Bliss in advance and utilize the perfect parries as you need them, which is why it's Essence 6.

This was the version I came up with earlier, but others thought it was too powerful, given the comparison to PoCB
Heavenly Mists Evasion


      Cost:  4 motes, 1 Willpower


      Duration: One Turn


      Type: Reflexive


      Minimum Dodge: 5


      Minimum Essence: 4


      Prerequisite Charms:  Seven Shadow Evasion, Flow Like Blood


      With the power of this charm, an Exalts attunement with the ambient essence allows minute motes of his form to evade for a few moments while the rest of his form may remain intact until the magic of this charm has run its course.  While this charm is active, the character appears translucent and smokey, his form a living mist itself.


      The character may use this charm to evade, without his player rolling, any number of attacks against him, wether aware of them or not, during the turn of it's activation.  These attacks may be dodged even if the attack is not normally dodgeable, such as that from a swarm of diamond bees, or a tidal wave of lava.  This charm may only be activated, however, against an attack that the character anticipates - Its effects cannot be used as a form of Reflex Sidestep Technique.

Ironically, the Charm you've described here is almost identical to what I described above.  I guess we're thinking on the same track.  I'd make it cost 6 motes and 1 willpower rather than 4 -- 4 and a willpower is what I'd charge for a single HGD style dodge.

While I'm at it, Id appreciate your(or anyone else') take on that persistant doubler too.  How do you view this charm in terms of tuning?
Peerless Motion Prana


      Cost: 5 motes, 1 willpower


      Duration: Scene


      Type: Supplemental


      Minimum Dodge: 5


      Minimum Essence: 3


      Prerequisite Charms: Flexing Darkness Evasion


      When an Exalt enacts this powerful technique, a disk of golden light surrounds their body, visible for but a fleeting moment.  This radius of patterned anima feeds into the Exalt as he moves, granting him the pervasiveness of the Unconquered Sun himself, everywhere and nowhere - Creating and being the incarnate of all light and shadow.


      This charm may be invoked after an attack against the character is rolled.  For the rest of the scene, all of the Exalt's total successes are doubled.

I'd make it cost more motes, simply because it's SO good combined with Flow Like Blood.

 

[Joseph]

PoCB makes your melee in blocks, when I was thinking scene length...  this kinda outdoes that.

It does your Melee in blocks, but they are HANGING blocks.  You activate this, and then you get your Melee in perfect blocks to use as you choose.  This means that you can activate this at the start of combat, then fight as usual without having to worry about keeping your Charm open in case you need to HGD.


I think the turn long perfect dodge does not trump it as such, since ALL you'll be using Charm-wise in the turn you use it is the dodge Charm, while Protection of Celestial Bliss can create all sorts of horrifying effects wherein you essentially get perfect blocks AND the benefits of another Charm or Combo in a given turn without worry.

 

[MOK]

oh yeah...

 

[MOK]

Hah!  well then to make this thread complete, I will ask your thoughts(and anyone elses') on my 4th dodge charm -


Light and Shadow Vengeance


      Cost: 3 motes


      Duration: Instant


      Type: Supplemental


      Minimum Dodge: 3


      Minimum Essence: 2


      Prerequisite Charms: Shadow over Water


      An Exalt who wields this charm possesses sufficient skill in his evasion to allow it to be used in offensive capacities.  By allowing essence to guide his movements, the Exalt may tailor his dodge in such a way that he is in the perfect position to exploit his opponent's extension to perform a devastating attack of his own.


      This charm may be invoked after an attack against the character is declared, but before it is rolled.  If this attack is successfully evaded with a dodge, the extra successes from the dodge roll may be converted to additional dice toward the next attack action performed against the target.  The total dice used in this subsequent attack may not exceed the exalt's default die limit [2(Attribute+Ability)].  This charm is expressly permitted to be part of a combo including charms of different abilities.


Figure I'll toss these into the submission's section next after your thoughts on this one.  As per usual, I want to polish these charms, and make sure theyre not... er...  stupid.


Thanks for the words, btw.

 

[Haku1]

That looks interesting. But I would make it -reflexive-.


Also, here's a pair of dodge charms you could be packing when you get up high enough.


****


Illusionary Dance of the Sunbeam


     Cost: 1 mote per die added and 1 willpower


     Duration: Scene


     Type: Reflexive


     Minimum Dodge: 5


     Minimum Essence: 3


     Prerequisite Charms: Flow like Blood


Calling on the fluidity of the essence within them, the solar is unspeakably graceful in his movements, seeming to weave in and out of sight like a mirage. Blows that would land on the solar simply miss as if he were not there.


For the rest of the scene in which this charm is activated, the solar has his dodge diepool increased at cost of 1 willpower to activate the charm and 1 mote per die added to the die pool. The solar can not buy more die then his natural die-adding limit of [Attribute + Ability].


This charm also allows the solar to reflexively dodge any attack, perceived or not, with the amount of die purchased if he does not wish to or can not activate a reflexive dodge charm (such as shadow over water) or does not have a persistent dodge charm active (such as Flow like Blood).


Liquid Orichalcum Defense


     Cost: 7 motes + 1 willpower


     Duration: 5 turns


     Type: Reflexive


     Minimum Dodge: 5


     Minimum Essence: 4


     Prerequisite Charms: Illusionary Dance of the Sunbeam


Solars and their magical metal take after their patron god in that they seek perfection. A solar with this charn literally flows like liquid orichalcum, dazzling fast and swift, leaving after-images as they move. All attacks against this golden phantom simply miss.


After activation of this charm, a solar can dodge any attack that is not stated to be undodgeable without the need for a roll for five turns. This effect applies to all attacks, perceived or not.


***


EDIT - Spelling and Grammar (preceived -> perceived // does -> does NOT)

 

[Persell]

Light and Shadow Vengeance's a step over counter attacks, which is nice.


I'd make it reflexive too.


I'd add that Perfect Dodges like SSE give the Solar's Dex + Dodge in dice on the counter-attack. It's obviously something to combo, and quite useless otherwise. But it can be very powerful in a combo.


You could even make a further Charm (like Essence 4 or 5) that does the same thing, but if you use a Perfect Defense, all attack dice are considered successes in the following counterattack. With the Dex + Dodge added to the counter attack, it's freaking deadly imho.

 

[Persell]

I'd make Liquid Orichalcum Defense a simple action, personnally. It's incredibly powerful. Maybe too much so imho. I'd never let a character have this in a game of mine (a starting PC could have it at chargen with one dot of flaws if he puts everything towards this, which is abusive imho).


Okay, he's screwed for everything else and I'd insult the player who does this, but still.


Oh, and I'm not sure about how merits and flaws work in Exalted since I don't have the PG, but I assumed they worked like in the oWOD, using the principle that says: "if you're a drunkard with one arm and one eye off, you should be more powerful". Stupid principle...

 

[Haku1]

I'd make Liquid Orichalcum Defense a simple action, personnally. It's incredibly powerful. Maybe too much so imho. I'd never let a character have this in a game of mine (a starting PC could have it at chargen with one dot of flaws if he puts everything towards this, which is abusive imho).
Okay, he's screwed for everything else and I'd insult the player who does this, but still.


Oh, and I'm not sure about how merits and flaws work in Exalted since I don't have the PG, but I assumed they worked like in the oWOD, using the principle that says: "if you're a drunkard with one arm and one eye off, you should be more powerful". Stupid principle...

It's not quite as screwed up as the sidereal martial arts that you could be walking about with if you want to... Perhaps simple might be better... but then it would also take the fangs out of what this charm can do. Which is allow you to concentrate on attacks for a few rounds, while your area is flowing around everything. ;;;


Also, bare in mind that solar charms tend to go really powerful at the mid essence range of 4 to 6, and presumably unspeakably powerful at essence 7 upwards.

 

[Haku1]

It's not quite as simple as that for merits and flaws... you do get some bonus points for flaws. BUT your flaws are more interesting then just drunkard with 1 arm and 1 eye, you're more powerful. Those sort of flaws give you piss-poor points. the flaws you want for min-maxing... no -sane- player would get... if only you're in effect playing into the ST's hands while he grins evilly.


And as always, an ST has the right to veto any and all flaws that the players tries to get if it does not fit.

 

[MOK]

I guess I'll need you guys' help on this - I heard two shots of "make it reflexive," yet this charm supplements a die action, rather than creating one.  I guess I don't get the difference between supplemental & reflexive, completely.


Also, I dont think the charm would be applicable with 7SE...  It doesn't seem thematically right to me.  I think it should just be not applicable since there was no die action to work from.  Mostly I saw it shining with persistants up, or in combos.  If you can get the timing right, two combos in a row with this one in the first could add a nice chunk of dice to a following attack combo.


Though, I don't know if I'd call it a step OVER counterattacks, its ... different.  And more limited.


Now, Liquid Orichalcum Defense is an awsome concept, but I think 5 turns is over the top, even for Essence 4.  My gut says tone it down to something that an opponent can actually do something against.  While essence 4 marks the start of insanity, I don't know if its quite that fargone so soon.


To make sure I'm undersanding Illusionary Dance of the Sunbeam:  When you purchase dice it gets added like reed in the wind, but sticks for the rest of the scene?  And it acts as a free reflexive that stacks with flow like blood?  And it dodges the unseen?  Yeeeouch!  Looking at Blade of the Battle Maiden, I guess it's balanced, but for some reason I want to think that it should cost more motes, and no willpower.  I have no reason to think this whatsoever and I am crazy.  But when I think back on the statement, I have no regrets!  


Still, a wrongness seems to surround this charm like a lingering hive of evil gnats....   I know not what it is which I sense.  


I am, however, shivering with flavor at the SHEER AWSOMENESS of the bad-assery!


Oh man...  Solar dodge makes me want to run in circles to channel my excitement.  Damn, maybe I shouldn't be consuming caffeine before sleep?


(Edit:  I figured out part of the black feeling thats creeping around me when I read that Illusioning Dodge McSunbeam thing.  It steps on the toes of Reflex Sidestep Technique to a degree.  SACRED GROUND I say!  Blasphemy!!1)


(Edit edit:  Did you guys see Kingdom of Heaven?  And that part where that bishop or whatever guy sprang like a jack-in-the-box, "HERESY!  BLASPHEMY!"  hehe, that was the best part of the movie.  Good memories of Monty Python rode through my mind in their own multi-color Terry Gilliam borne train, cut-out paper jaws flapping the whole way....)


(Oh christ the caffeine, how am I going to get up on time?!)

 

[Haku1]

I guess I'll need you guys' help on this - I heard two shots of "make it reflexive," yet this charm supplements a die action, rather than creating one.  I guess I don't get the difference between supplemental & reflexive, completely.

Reflexive would make more sense then say supplemental, as you could have a dodge attempt that is before your action, or say you have a reflexive dodge effect going, in which case, this charm would be reflexive as it can be activated out of turn. If you go with supplementa;, it gets... kinda screwy. But it would still be workable. as either reflexive or supplemental. It's your call.

Also, I dont think the charm would be applicable with 7SE...  It doesn't seem thematically right to me.  I think it should just be not applicable since there was no die action to work from.  Mostly I saw it shining with persistants up, or in combos.  If you can get the timing right, two combos in a row with this one in the first could add a nice chunk of dice to a following attack combo.
Though, I don't know if I'd call it a step OVER counterattacks, its ... different.  And more limited.

Hmmm... you might want to take a look at the Abyssal counter attack charm "Vengeful Ripose" on page 170 of E:Abyssal, as it's similiar to what you're thinking of here in effect.


Also, if it's of limited use, its cost might go down.

Now, Liquid Orichalcum Defense is an awsome concept, but I think 5 turns is over the top, even for Essence 4.  My gut says tone it down to something that an opponent can actually do something against.  While essence 4 marks the start of insanity, I don't know if its quite that fargone so soon.

:twisted: Not really... think of the cost of what it took you to get here, how many charms in you are. at dodge 5, essence 4, and 7 charms in... it's supposed to be insane. Of course, it might be more 'reasonable' at essence 5, but I don't really think so.


Also, this charm can be defeated with 'perfect' attacks, like cascade of cutting terror (2 charms in, thrown 3, essence 3), accuracy without distance (3 charms in, archery 5, essence 1). It's not truly invincible defense, but it's close. it's damn close.

To make sure I'm undersanding Illusionary Dance of the Sunbeam:  When you purchase dice it gets added like reed in the wind, but sticks for the rest of the scene?  And it acts as a free reflexive that stacks with flow like blood?  And it dodges the unseen?  Yeeeouch!  Looking at Blade of the Battle Maiden, I guess it's balanced, but for some reason I want to think that it should cost more motes, and no willpower.  I have no reason to think this whatsoever and I am crazy.  But when I think back on the statement, I have no regrets!  
Still, a wrongness seems to surround this charm like a lingering hive of evil gnats....   I know not what it is which I sense.  


I am, however, shivering with flavor at the SHEER AWSOMENESS of the bad-assery!


Oh man...  Solar dodge makes me want to run in circles to channel my excitement.  Damn, maybe I shouldn't be consuming caffeine before sleep?


(Edit:  I figured out part of the black feeling thats creeping around me when I read that Illusioning Dodge McSunbeam thing.  It steps on the toes of Reflex Sidestep Technique to a degree.  SACRED GROUND I say!  Blasphemy!!1)


(Edit edit:  Did you guys see Kingdom of Heaven?  And that part where that bishop or whatever guy sprang like a jack-in-the-box, "HERESY!  BLASPHEMY!"  hehe, that was the best part of the movie.  Good memories of Monty Python rode through my mind in their own multi-color Terry Gilliam borne train, cut-out paper jaws flapping the whole way....)


(Oh christ the caffeine, how am I going to get up on time?!)

Heh heh heh... there is only so much it can do. First I thought it would be reasonable to have a scene long die adder for dodge, the cost is relatively low compared to say blade of the battle maiden.


Now once you've added the die, it should stick around, yes? Which is when I looked at the terresterial style '5 Dragon fight as 1', and its persistent parry effect where the MA gets to reflexive parry attacks with his essence trait. I felt if you've got THAT hanging about, why not include that in there.


The reflexive dodge is only for whta die you actually bought, so if you only bought 4 die of dodge, then you ONLY get a dodge pool of 4 if you don't invoke shadow over water or go full dodge.


As for the unseen, why not? I mean the major underpinning of flow like blood was that invisible attacks could be dodged. So I tossed that in there as well. No more sneak attacks on you when this charm is up and running...  8)


However, if someone tosses cascade of cutting terror at you, you're SoL. Ditto with other perfect attacks like Azure Abacus Meditation (player's guide, page 256).

 

[Persell]

re


Cool.

 

[Knight_of_Chaos]

Re: re

Cool.

Are you an Abyssal?  Because you just whipped out some serious thread necromancy.

 

[Quchu]

I think he's trying to create a Shadowland, I spotted another case of necromantic ritual in the Blessed Isle.


...well on a more serious note.


Reviving a year (or 2) old thread is often looked down upon, especially when the post that resurrected the thread does not significantly contribute to the topic of the thread... So, unless you have something to share with others, you don't have to tell people that you agree with what's been said or you think the thread is cool. >_>


Just a common silly netiquette.

 

[Knight_of_Chaos]

I think he's trying to create a Shadowland' date=' I spotted another case of necromantic ritual in the Blessed Isle.[/quote']
Well played, sir.  Well played indeed.

 

[Ledaal Kajiri]

Damn, seems I have to get out the salt again and set to the rituals to cleanse the Shadowland. Sometimes it sucks having Occult favored...everyone assumes you're the right person for the dirty jobs...

 

[Ker'ion]

No.  You have the slaves do the salt lines.  You just get to bless it.


Or have Flagg pull that Destroy Shadowland Spell.

 

[Ledaal Kajiri]

But can you really trust the slaves to do it right? I mean, they're place in the world is to serve and learn from their Dragonblooded masters... trusting someone so low in enlightenment with something as important as fixing a Shadowland...that seems foolish and dangerous.


Occasioanlly it's fun to play someone who truly believes the Immaculate Philosphy...who isn't a monk.

 

[Jack1]

On the other hand, this thread did raise a valid point back when it was still young.


Solar dodge is very limited, and not nearly as cool as any other exalt types dodge tree.


What can be done about this?

 

[Flagg]

Solar dodge is very limited

Since when? Sure you can't move cities and dodge hurt feelings and shit like certain other Exalts, I don't really see what Solar Dodge is lacking in terms of getting out of the way of pointy things.


Please elaborate.

 

[Ledaal Kajiri]

I have to agree with Flagg here. What exactly do you mean? Solar dodge is as good as it gets for actually...dodging things. Even more so in 2nd ed, now that its perfect dodge is just as perfect as Heavenly Guardian Defense (i.e. can dodge undodgeable attacks). Now, while it lacks either counter attack charms, or insane effects unrelated to the actual dodge ability...I fail to see how this is a failing in an ability based on not getting hit.