AlexneushoornTheGreat
Steve Rhino
Sonic and Sally breaking up in the Pre-Super Genesis Wave continuity of the Sonic the Hedgehog Archie Comics or the Duncan-Gwen-Courtney love triangle in Total Drama World Tour.
Other Random question of the day
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WhiskeyMarten
I am FangS31
I for one loved the duncan-gwen-courtney love triangle.
Cosmo
Does Not Know Kung-fu
At first I thought you meant like, when the superior orders a subordinate to do something morally ambiguous that creates drama, but you mean like.. When higher ups force the writers/creators to manufacture relationships in order to generate drama that is supposed to be fun to watch but can end up alienating the viewer? I'ma run with the second one.
Honestly, I had no idea the Gwen-Courtney-Duncan thing was ordered by the higher ups. Although I think the only romantic relationship I really liked in that was Alejandro and Heather which I thought was both funny and adorable. [For best friendship/overall relationship, its Noah/Owen or bust]. Didn't mind Emma and Noah either.
Anyways, while I wasn't a big fan of the triangle, mostly because while I like Courtney, I was never much of a Duncan or Gwen fan [as characters]. But it is pretty normal. People enjoy romance, they enjoy drama, you mix them together and you get cheating/love triangles which tend to generate a lot of buzz.
More buzz, more conversations, more word of mouth, more interest and more views for your show. Sometimes it works well, sometimes it doesn't. The only really bad ones are when the characters clearly have no chemistry, but for some reason or another, someone doesn't want to admit defeat so keeps trying to shove it down the throats of the viewers come hell or high water.
EDIT: Actually, thinking on it, I like most relationships in the show.. Think I just don't like Gwen and Duncan.
Honestly, I had no idea the Gwen-Courtney-Duncan thing was ordered by the higher ups. Although I think the only romantic relationship I really liked in that was Alejandro and Heather which I thought was both funny and adorable. [For best friendship/overall relationship, its Noah/Owen or bust]. Didn't mind Emma and Noah either.
Anyways, while I wasn't a big fan of the triangle, mostly because while I like Courtney, I was never much of a Duncan or Gwen fan [as characters]. But it is pretty normal. People enjoy romance, they enjoy drama, you mix them together and you get cheating/love triangles which tend to generate a lot of buzz.
More buzz, more conversations, more word of mouth, more interest and more views for your show. Sometimes it works well, sometimes it doesn't. The only really bad ones are when the characters clearly have no chemistry, but for some reason or another, someone doesn't want to admit defeat so keeps trying to shove it down the throats of the viewers come hell or high water.
EDIT: Actually, thinking on it, I like most relationships in the show.. Think I just don't like Gwen and Duncan.
AlexneushoornTheGreat
Steve Rhino
Random question of the day:
What's the most infuriating experience you've ever had to endure with an employee at a store?
What's the most infuriating experience you've ever had to endure with an employee at a store?
Kaiju Cat
Demon spoon cat stand
Dealing with a racist at my local grocery store.
Last edited:
Mitheral
"Growf!"
Buying a new phone at a popular provider store. (I won't say which one.) And it was an employee and his manager. Never had ruder customer service - and I am almost 60 years old. The store routinely gets rated 1 and 2. At one point all I asked was how to change the font size so I could read the display. The access to Settings looked very different from my old phone. Got told it was my phone now and I needed to figure it out for myself.
Idea
The Pun Tyrant
I began answering the self-insert question only to realize "oops it's not the latest question" way too far into it... so I decided to finish it and answer today's question as well.
Because, generally speaking, if you can tell the character is a self-insert that’s a direct result of their poor writing. A good enough self insert will not call attention to the fact they are a self insert because they will blend in with the rest of the cast in the sense of feeling like just another character, an integrated part of the world. On the other hand, self-inserts often:
-Suffer from over-attachment: The author is likely to have undue emotional attachment to the self-insert’s well being over that of the narrative. As a result, the story will warp to benefit that character, resulting in a potential number of other problems. Other character’s consistently getting robbed of achievement and defining traits in favor of the self-insert (in the sense of either getting shown up, rendered useless or temporarily “forgetting” they have that trait while the self-insert deals with the issue). Every character putting undue attention on and having an unnaturally high evaluation of that character. They become a Deus Ex Machina that can often be the solution to every problem they come across for no good reason and at the detriment of the rest of the cast. Anything they do wrong, the story will go out of its way to at least justify it, if not make them in the right in some other way, at least from the author's perspective.
-Are written too perfect because they are a distorted mirror: Everyone and their grandma knows (or should know) we don't really have a proper view of ourselves. We tend to overestimate ourselves, though specific people will tend to underestimate themselves, though even them will tend to overestimate the accuracy of their own thoughts. Regardless, the point is we don’t see ourselves the way we might see a character we’re constructing and the result is a narrative role of the character where the worst of flaws will be dismissed or treated as a good thing actually, and qualities will be turned up to eleven, especially when it comes to their impact. The character will on either case be correct about just about anything, with the universe seeming to go out of its way to make it so, as naturally the author is like any person as as thinking what they believe in to be true (otherwise they wouldn’t believe in it).
Now, these characteristics can be, for better or for worse, intensified even further if we go from your run of the mill self-insert to an outright wish fulfillment self-insert, though those can sometimes be more forgivable because the audience kinda gets that’s the point, so it can turned into something that contributes rather than detracting from the story. It should also be mentioned again that I’m talking specifically about self-inserts that are noticeable, and they are noticeable because of flaws like the above making it shown. You may have noticed that they share an awful lot of similarities with the Mary Sue - and that’s because the two are often overlapped - however there is one more aspect that can make a self-insert noticeable that has less in common with that archetype.
-Bringing the author breaks immersion: There are many ways an author can insert themselves into a character, though some tend to be a bit more visible than others. It can range from looks (in visual mediums) to the character spouting the author’s opinions (and usually being proven right while making any opposition out to be stupid or evil) to having some hyper-specific condition or aspect of their life , or some some combination of the aforementioned, putting a great emphasis on the hardships of it even if the story is not an exploration of it (and it should be noted that this can be done without a self-insert being necessarily involved, but it’s hard to properly describe what a self-indulgent tone looks like, but even written well it’s still likely that, for example, a story about a character with a very specific psychological disorder is going to be written by someone who has it based on their own experiences with it, thus likely to be a self-insert, just potentially a better written one). Whatever the case, it’s something that can really take one out of the world of the story, the author’s hand becomes more visible, it’s hard to detach from the view of the self-insert as the author once you’ve noticed it, and in some of the worst cases the story ceases to look like a story at all, and comes across like a rant or pity party instead.
So, to reiterate: A self-insert is generally noticeable through the flaws in writing them. If those flaws aren’t present, you generally won’t notice the self-insert, or will notice them and think about them a lot less. To add insult to injury, self-inserts are often the work of less experienced writers, who either haven't yet grasped the method for or the notion that they should differentiate themselves from their characters, or who began writing precisely because they wanted to make a story in their minds who starred "themselves" as the protagonist (most common among the younger crowd) or both. So on top of only tending to perceive the bad side of self-inserts, most self-inserts will naturally tend to be written worse because they tend to be written by writers who don't have the experience to have honed their skills yet.
The result? It's not inherent that a self-insert is poorly written, but in most cases it is true, and if you go in those cases where we know it is a self-insert then that from most to almost all of them.
I haven't really encountered anything catastrophic I would say, to my memory. Then again, I tend to forget this type of thing pretty easily.
One complaint I have though, is with some McDonalds employees. A recent case was when I went to pick some for myself and my siblings, in celebration of a certain exam going well for my younger sister. As I selected the food, the I accidentally ordered a mini McFlurry instead of a regular sized one. I tried to change it, but the machine had no way to delete one of the products unless I started over which, when ordering for 5 people, is a hassle. So I ordered the normal one as well, selected the option to pay at the counter, and figured I'd just explain to the employee that I didn't mean to order the mini McFlurry and to please remove it from the order.
When I got there however, the employee didn't immediately understand what I was asking for them. So I began again, I reiterated several times what I wanted removed, I even pointed it out in the paper. Then I paid, and looked at the receipt... only to realize they kept the Mini and removed the regular sized one. I complained that they got it wrong, and they started arguing with me. If they misheard me once or twice, that would be fine fine, but if I say the same thing over and over I don't think it's unreasonable to expect them to have understood me. They still seemed confused, so they called their manager and I explained the situation. Good call. Just wish they didn't do it by shouting and then loudly going over what the situation was. The situation only got increasingly awkward as other people started looking over to see what was going on, but I finally managed to get the correct order and paid the extra for the difference (I'm pretty sure I already paid the full amount before, but at that point I didn't want to drag things out anymore).
Following this was one of my biggest gripes with McDonalds in general, which is the first part of the order they got was the icecream. They just let it sit there, melting, while they cook the rest. Now, I don't expect anything much, you don't go to McDonalds for fine French cuisine served to you by elegant waiters that refill a cup of water every time you take a sip. But there's a difference between below average service and choosing the single worst possible approach short of intentionally throwing food at the floor and putting back into the bag.
In the end though, I took my order, and didn't immediately confirm, I just wanted to get out of there, since on top of the awkwardness I was still in an exam period so I needed to hurry up to have dinner and get back to studying. Of course, when I got home I realized they didn't put any sauces in either. Not even the ones that were paid for.
All in all, somewhat petty complaints I realize. But it's a recent experience and like I said, I don't tend to remember these either way, so it's the best I've got.
Because, generally speaking, if you can tell the character is a self-insert that’s a direct result of their poor writing. A good enough self insert will not call attention to the fact they are a self insert because they will blend in with the rest of the cast in the sense of feeling like just another character, an integrated part of the world. On the other hand, self-inserts often:
-Suffer from over-attachment: The author is likely to have undue emotional attachment to the self-insert’s well being over that of the narrative. As a result, the story will warp to benefit that character, resulting in a potential number of other problems. Other character’s consistently getting robbed of achievement and defining traits in favor of the self-insert (in the sense of either getting shown up, rendered useless or temporarily “forgetting” they have that trait while the self-insert deals with the issue). Every character putting undue attention on and having an unnaturally high evaluation of that character. They become a Deus Ex Machina that can often be the solution to every problem they come across for no good reason and at the detriment of the rest of the cast. Anything they do wrong, the story will go out of its way to at least justify it, if not make them in the right in some other way, at least from the author's perspective.
-Are written too perfect because they are a distorted mirror: Everyone and their grandma knows (or should know) we don't really have a proper view of ourselves. We tend to overestimate ourselves, though specific people will tend to underestimate themselves, though even them will tend to overestimate the accuracy of their own thoughts. Regardless, the point is we don’t see ourselves the way we might see a character we’re constructing and the result is a narrative role of the character where the worst of flaws will be dismissed or treated as a good thing actually, and qualities will be turned up to eleven, especially when it comes to their impact. The character will on either case be correct about just about anything, with the universe seeming to go out of its way to make it so, as naturally the author is like any person as as thinking what they believe in to be true (otherwise they wouldn’t believe in it).
Now, these characteristics can be, for better or for worse, intensified even further if we go from your run of the mill self-insert to an outright wish fulfillment self-insert, though those can sometimes be more forgivable because the audience kinda gets that’s the point, so it can turned into something that contributes rather than detracting from the story. It should also be mentioned again that I’m talking specifically about self-inserts that are noticeable, and they are noticeable because of flaws like the above making it shown. You may have noticed that they share an awful lot of similarities with the Mary Sue - and that’s because the two are often overlapped - however there is one more aspect that can make a self-insert noticeable that has less in common with that archetype.
-Bringing the author breaks immersion: There are many ways an author can insert themselves into a character, though some tend to be a bit more visible than others. It can range from looks (in visual mediums) to the character spouting the author’s opinions (and usually being proven right while making any opposition out to be stupid or evil) to having some hyper-specific condition or aspect of their life , or some some combination of the aforementioned, putting a great emphasis on the hardships of it even if the story is not an exploration of it (and it should be noted that this can be done without a self-insert being necessarily involved, but it’s hard to properly describe what a self-indulgent tone looks like, but even written well it’s still likely that, for example, a story about a character with a very specific psychological disorder is going to be written by someone who has it based on their own experiences with it, thus likely to be a self-insert, just potentially a better written one). Whatever the case, it’s something that can really take one out of the world of the story, the author’s hand becomes more visible, it’s hard to detach from the view of the self-insert as the author once you’ve noticed it, and in some of the worst cases the story ceases to look like a story at all, and comes across like a rant or pity party instead.
So, to reiterate: A self-insert is generally noticeable through the flaws in writing them. If those flaws aren’t present, you generally won’t notice the self-insert, or will notice them and think about them a lot less. To add insult to injury, self-inserts are often the work of less experienced writers, who either haven't yet grasped the method for or the notion that they should differentiate themselves from their characters, or who began writing precisely because they wanted to make a story in their minds who starred "themselves" as the protagonist (most common among the younger crowd) or both. So on top of only tending to perceive the bad side of self-inserts, most self-inserts will naturally tend to be written worse because they tend to be written by writers who don't have the experience to have honed their skills yet.
The result? It's not inherent that a self-insert is poorly written, but in most cases it is true, and if you go in those cases where we know it is a self-insert then that from most to almost all of them.
I haven't really encountered anything catastrophic I would say, to my memory. Then again, I tend to forget this type of thing pretty easily.
One complaint I have though, is with some McDonalds employees. A recent case was when I went to pick some for myself and my siblings, in celebration of a certain exam going well for my younger sister. As I selected the food, the I accidentally ordered a mini McFlurry instead of a regular sized one. I tried to change it, but the machine had no way to delete one of the products unless I started over which, when ordering for 5 people, is a hassle. So I ordered the normal one as well, selected the option to pay at the counter, and figured I'd just explain to the employee that I didn't mean to order the mini McFlurry and to please remove it from the order.
When I got there however, the employee didn't immediately understand what I was asking for them. So I began again, I reiterated several times what I wanted removed, I even pointed it out in the paper. Then I paid, and looked at the receipt... only to realize they kept the Mini and removed the regular sized one. I complained that they got it wrong, and they started arguing with me. If they misheard me once or twice, that would be fine fine, but if I say the same thing over and over I don't think it's unreasonable to expect them to have understood me. They still seemed confused, so they called their manager and I explained the situation. Good call. Just wish they didn't do it by shouting and then loudly going over what the situation was. The situation only got increasingly awkward as other people started looking over to see what was going on, but I finally managed to get the correct order and paid the extra for the difference (I'm pretty sure I already paid the full amount before, but at that point I didn't want to drag things out anymore).
Following this was one of my biggest gripes with McDonalds in general, which is the first part of the order they got was the icecream. They just let it sit there, melting, while they cook the rest. Now, I don't expect anything much, you don't go to McDonalds for fine French cuisine served to you by elegant waiters that refill a cup of water every time you take a sip. But there's a difference between below average service and choosing the single worst possible approach short of intentionally throwing food at the floor and putting back into the bag.
In the end though, I took my order, and didn't immediately confirm, I just wanted to get out of there, since on top of the awkwardness I was still in an exam period so I needed to hurry up to have dinner and get back to studying. Of course, when I got home I realized they didn't put any sauces in either. Not even the ones that were paid for.
All in all, somewhat petty complaints I realize. But it's a recent experience and like I said, I don't tend to remember these either way, so it's the best I've got.
AstroBeans
Creative Pyromaniac
An employee threaten to kick us out because me and my sister was chasing my autistic little brother. He runs quite fast and grabbed a snack cake quickly then ran. We tried to tell the employee that he was autistic.
AlexneushoornTheGreat
Steve Rhino
Random question of the day:
Why is it that when the Hulk transforms, all of his clothes rip apart, but then She-Hulk transforms, only her shoes break?
Why is it that when the Hulk transforms, all of his clothes rip apart, but then She-Hulk transforms, only her shoes break?
Idea
The Pun Tyrant
Rules on exposure in general, I would say.
Mitheral
"Growf!"
Old Comic Book Authority Codes. They pretty much lost their authority in 1989 and officially as far as Marvel was concerned in 2001.
There was a bit of talk back before the days of social media in the 80's. I collected the comic starting at Issue 1. (I pretty much collected most of the Marvel lines during the 80's. And DC and Dark Horse Comics, plus some more obscure stuff.)
There was actually a story line where paparazzi got a pic She Hulk and doctored it (before the days of photoshop) to make the photo more ... well less clothed.
There was a bit of talk back before the days of social media in the 80's. I collected the comic starting at Issue 1. (I pretty much collected most of the Marvel lines during the 80's. And DC and Dark Horse Comics, plus some more obscure stuff.)
There was actually a story line where paparazzi got a pic She Hulk and doctored it (before the days of photoshop) to make the photo more ... well less clothed.
Rin okumura
pacifist by nature demon by birth
Fact females can't be top less without a sports bra I'd just say mainly do to that reason irl and cause she doesn't gain the same muscle mass as her cousin and plus its comic books some things can just make no sense
Murdergurl
will turn your insides into your outsides
Ehh... i have a couple of the Archie Sonic The Hedgehog Comics from back in the 90s. but tbh, was not an avid enough fan to actually keep up on them. Never actually followed the story. A far as the Total Drama World Tour... I've never heard of it.
I feel like I'm honestly out of the loop when it comes to a lot of media, tbh.
But I think I know what you're getting at. And melodrama is not something I seek out in ANY media. So yeah, I can see how other fans might also find that element distasteful and annoying to pop up in their fandoms
AlexneushoornTheGreat
Steve Rhino
Random question of the day:
Would you rather be as big as a battleship for a week or be as small as a chess piece for a week?
Would you rather be as big as a battleship for a week or be as small as a chess piece for a week?
Mitheral
"Growf!"
Tough call. I'll opt for battleship.
Kaiju Cat
Demon spoon cat stand
I’m happy with the I am so I say neither.
Idea
The Pun Tyrant
I think chess piece would be the better option out of the two. Assuming that everything changes proportionally, being as large as the other option makes you could cause a lot of property damage, and would require a ton of food, not to mention likely not having anywhere you can actually stay for shelter on short notice. Becoming very small would be annoying in a lot of ways, but you're not becoming so small that people can't notice you and you'd be a lot easier to help. In fact you'd probably need less to live relatively comfortably.
Daisie
Seared with story
I'm sorry to inform you that that's not how would-you-rather questions work XD
Well, I don't want to get bunches of attention and accidentally crush a bunch of things that I don't want to. Just not very viable in my life right now, lol, so I guess I'll try being as tiny as a chess piece for a week. Maybe I can still type and inform people of what's happening.
AlexneushoornTheGreat
Steve Rhino
Random question of the day:
If a fly loses its ability to fly, does it become a walk?
If a fly loses its ability to fly, does it become a walk?
Idea
The Pun Tyrant
It becomes a dead.
Mitheral
"Growf!"
Good question. My sleep fogged brain is trying to ponder this wisdom with a comparison to a bee. If a bee isn't, the whole to bee or not to bee idea would mean that it a fly was a walk, a bee wouldn't bee.
AstroBeans
Creative Pyromaniac
It would be dead due to its lack of flight. Not because it doesn’t have its wings. People would catch and kill them more.
Macintot
WeeWoo
Nah, an animal's species doesn't change just because it loses limbs or otherwise becomes injured.
Murdergurl
will turn your insides into your outsides
That's not true! How do you think we got snakes? A lizard lost its legs, duh! Then it got do angry that it grew venomous fangs!
AlexneushoornTheGreat
Steve Rhino
Random question of the day:
What's one thing that the internet has taught us?
What's one thing that the internet has taught us?
