[OOC Thread] [The Resurgent]

[kaliket]

What I meant was "Let me know when I'm back in the room with the Mayor." Although I've just had the idea to go grab a drink in frustration.


To my knowledge, no time has passed there, so it would be odd for me to return immediately.

 

[Tikor]

What I meant was "Let me know when I'm back in the room with the Mayor."

Yes. You can move yourself back there when you are ready.

To my knowledge, no time has passed there, so it would be odd for me to return immediately.

Long ticks are full minutes, so your quick exchange likely did not take too many of them. I'd say it's safe to reintroduce you on Tick 11 or thereabouts if you turned around right now. That said, you'll have to make a Join Debate action when you get back to re-join the conversation mechanically (as in, you can be physically there ~Tick 11 but you won't get an action for maybe a few more ticks depending on your Join Debate roll).


If you decide to talk to people out here in the party then I think a later Tick for reappearance would make sense. Depending on how long you stay, I'll revise my estimate.

 

[kaliket]

Here's a socialize action I want to take, but not sure how to get started. There are a couple goals.


#1 Cover our trail/escape from Gateway by inserting conflicting rumors about how and when the Anathema left.


#2 Heighten the sense that the Realm doesn't care about the people of Gateway


#3 Warn the population of Gateway that the Wyld Hunt may attack at Calibration's Eve

 

[Tikor]

Here's a socialize action I want to take

I think you mean actions

#1 Cover our trail/escape from Gateway by inserting conflicting rumors about how and when the Anathema left.

Spreading rumors is a [Attribute]+Socialize roll. You'll have to find targets to start them with, but that shouldn't be too hard. They may or may not catch. Successes help in this.

#2 Heighten the sense that the Realm doesn't care about the people of Gateway

Again, rumors are an option. Also public speaking (Performance) or personally leading (Presence). Basically just find NPCs to interact with.

#3 Warn the population of Gateway that the Wyld Hunt may attack at Calibration's Eve

Again, rumors are an option. Also public speaking (Performance) or personally leading (Presence). Basically just find NPCs to interact with.


In all of these your Connections Wavecrest will help you out (You can roll up just the right person to talk to if you roll your Contact dice and succeed) . BTW, you have Connections, not Contact. I'm favoring the DB book version, not Core's. You could use your Backing, Followers, and/or Resources as well if you get creative.


And even though it probably doesn't need to be said, there are Charms that could help you do these sort of things easily.

 

[kaliket]

Mental Parry edited.

 

[Tikor]

Edited in steps 3 and 5.


Your move.

 

[Kalarix]

what are your intentions with the man?

Investigation instead of presence I think.

 

[kaliket]

Questions that demand an answer are Investigation? Do I need to phrase each Presence attack as a command?

 

[Kalarix]

I'm not sure :-p


Just posting my understanding of it.

 

[kaliket]

White Wolf must think social combat is a trivial part of the game. Its mentioned but not developed at all. I haven't counted exactly, but it seems that combat related charms equal all other charms in number.

 

[Tikor]

Kalarix, I was just looking through the Solar Charmset to reply to Kaliket's post when I noticed Terrifying Apparition of Glory (Supplemental, makes MDDV inapplicable, 3m.) As you know MPDV is usually lower (and only actual Social Combatants typically have much of it). This is a Charm that will seriously disrupt characters like Innaru (high WP but not necessarily a Social type character) and still give you 3m worth of excellency's punch on most everybody. You might consider making a combo with this, an excellency and a defensive Charm for a good Social M.O. combo.

 

[Tikor]

White Wolf must think social combat is a trivial part of the game. Its mentioned but not developed at all. I haven't counted exactly, but it seems that combat related charms equal all other charms in number.

Charm count, and more generally space spent on mechanics, doesn't exactly indicate how much of the game the writers think it will encompass. Mechanics are best focused around situations in which there is going to be a large amount of disagreement of outcome between the parties, and player expectations. Example:


Player: I swing my sword to hit you!


almost always results in


NPC: I try to stop you!


Mechanically represented by declaring defense in Step 2.


as opposed to:


Player: I make a well-stunted convincing argument!


sometimes results in


NPC: That sounds reasonable.


Mechanically represented by declaring no defense in Step 2. Only Step 10 comes into play after this.


Because defense is declared less often in Social Combat than God-Kicking Combat, there's less Mechanics (Charms, systems, ect.) that modify how various attacks and defenses work.


Also, I suggest checking out the Abyssals book where there are a number of mirror Charms that expand the Solar Charmset sneaky-like. Most of them are non-combat iirc.


Additionally I take argument with the original premise that Social Combat isn't developed. The systems seems to be functioning well so far and I see roughly 60 Charms in a quick look through of Core that deal with Social Combat in some way (admittedly, more deal with God-Kicking Combat). The mechanics aren't exactly well organized (some in the Social Combat part, some at the beginning of the Charms chapter) and they rely on a solid understanding of the Combat mechanics (10 Steps of Combat, Charm use, Combos, concept of MDV ect.) so they are shorter in wordcount, for sure. It's not developed as much as I'd like (see Virtue houserules) but it does have quite a bit of work done on it.


However, that won't stop us from fixing the situation. The Solar Charmset is not closed and if you find you're looking for a certain effect then we can make one up, price it properly and stick it in the tree somewhere.

 

[Tikor]

First off, I'm not going to be picky when there's lots of overlap like Presense and Investigation (I will be picky with Melee and Thrown). Balthazar wants to do a Presense attack, so it's a Presense attack. His stunt may or may not line up with that, and will be judged accordingly. The most he's losing is a stunt die, and even then not all the time. A 3 die stunt is a 3 die stunt, I'm not taking that away just because the Abilities don't match. Similarly only speaking in character (1 die stunt) will be 1 die even if the Abilites don't match. The Ability not matching the stunt will only change a 2 die stunt for the right ability to a 1 die stunt for the wrong Ability. What follows is stunt advice, and nothing more.

Questions that demand an answer are Investigation?

There is overlap in Presence and Investigation regarding 'questioning'. See page 107 of Core.


Presence is more force of personality or straight forceful persuation. Intimidation falls under Presence. So does leading troops, demanding respect ect. The usual tactic for Presence is "Trust me!" and/or "Fear me!" and then "Now answer my questions".


Investigation is more interviewing, asking pointed and informed questions. One need not respect/fear/trust the questioner, it is more subtle, less general and cannot issue commands. You can't lead troops or a ship with Investigation.

Do I need to phrase each Presence attack as a command?

It's not so clear-cut. If you've just beaten a prisoner bloody and are holding your beat stick above his head threatingly and ask "Are you going to tell me who you work for now?" That isn't a command (it's a question) but it's certainly Presence.


If you're at a trade negotiation going over ships and one of your partners is stammering when he gets to the last ship (that was recently lost) then asks "Where was I?" and you answer "You were about to tell me about The Moon's Charter." (the missing trade ship that he hasn't mentioned yet) it's a command and not a question, but you're clearly using Investigation.


Your attack towards Laughing Waves as written is closer to the Investigation side. It is not forceful, it's more inquisitive. To upgrade to a 2 die stunt put some command behind it (you've already included the social scenery mentioning Rillard will be a crewman of yours). This may not be in the quote itself, but around it with body language ect. Your "Balthazar stresses the last word ever so slightly" is on the right track, but I don't read command in that, only a pointed question.


That said, simply because you brought it up in OOC and sparked this dicussion I'm giving you a 2 die stunt.

 

[Tikor]

Regarding Act 4, I'll be posting Winter Breeze's action tonight (unless she beats me to it) and then posting for Petrin. (Why wait? 1) To give Mnemonsyne a last chance 2) I've got some notes for Petrin at home. I thought they were on google docs, but I was wrong.)

 

[kaliket]

Re: Laughing Waves


In accordance with the traditions of the West, her mother would oversee the landward operations of her salt-merchant father who likely tends to the import fleet. Who then is more powerful or formidable? Could they both be land-based?

 

[Tikor]

Re: Laughing Waves
In accordance with the traditions of the West, her mother would oversee the landward operations of her salt-merchant father who likely tends to the import fleet. Who then is more powerful or formidable? Could they both be land-based?

The tradition advocates this division of labor, but individual cases may deviate from this. It makes sense for the woman, being on land, to handle the land business and the man, being on the sea, to handle the sea business. However, just because it makes sense and is usually done doesn't mean it's always done. Mortals and Exalts fly in the face of reason daily.


I have not specified which of Laughing Waves' parents are more powerful or formitable. Your character knows them (and implied that her father was at least personally powerful over Laughing Waves previously) so you can feel free to make this up however you like. I've been assuming her father is powerful since he likely ships the salt to and fro, feel free to make this (or whatever you make up) explicit and I'll roll with it.

 

[Tikor]

Step 2, Noisy Cricket?

 

[Kalarix]

To clarify: Petrin is only attacking Cricket with that attack?

 

[NoisyCricket]

To clarify: Petrin is only attacking Cricket with that attack?

It is performance, so it is hitting everyone.

 

[Tikor]

To clarify: Petrin is only attacking Cricket with that attack?

It is performance, so it is hitting everyone.

Yes, please everyone declare your Step 2.

 

[Kalarix]

Can we still plan to have that vent get together to hasten some of this?


That, or have shorter limits for interaction during actual combat time?

 

[Kalarix]

Will post today, last chance for breeze :-p

 

[kaliket]

I'm clear for Vent pretty much whenever. Just give me 48 hours notice.

 

[Tikor]

Hey if any of you want to say something to the party, throw it up here and I'll relay it.

 

[kaliket]

Some one get Tikor another beer.