How should Kejak be Executed?

[Persell]

after the solars topple the realm and find out everything and stabilize everything , how should Kejak Die.

 

[Haku1]

I think he'll die taking down at least one circle of solars, a glorious pyhrric death for the solars as they take down the old man.

 

[Cthulhu_Wakes]

Eh, he dies in his sleep in my games, I let him go gracefully. Not stupidly.

 

[MikeOQuinn]

Eh' date=' he dies in his sleep in my games...[/quote']
... smothered by a pillow wielded by the Night Caste or Lunar who sneaks into his room...

 

[Jukashi]

Where's the "squished by Leviathan" option?

 

[RainOfSteel]

If the Solars can retake Creation against the Dragon Blooded, the much-larger-than-the-Golds Bronze Faction, the Fair Folk, the Deathlords, and the Yozis.


If the Solars can regain entry into Yu-Shan.


If these things can actually be accomplished, then the first thing that Kejak does is use 8 or 9 dots of Connections and 2000-3000 years of interpersonal relationships with all the greatest spirits of Yu-Shan (including, at least IMO, the Celestial Incarna and Gaia) to ask for things to be done in his favor.


First up is an audit of all the Solars.  The Celestial Bureaucracy is corrupt, and Kejak's "in" will make many of the audits go badly for the Solars, no matter what they might or might not have really done.


Second, if the Solars showed up and actually tried to do harm to Kejak, well, he undoubtedly has many military spirits of Ess 6-7 on hand, First Age A.I. automaton warstriders loaded with incredible weaponry, and equal fixed defenses.


In any event, a large band of Solars moving through the city would be reported to Kejak in short order.  Kejak is probably on a first name basis with many of the Celestial Lions.  Unless receiving very high level orders to the contrary, many lions would immediately leap to Kejak's aid against any attack.  They might be persuaded to move on the Solars before they had actually gone anywhere.


Not to mention that Kejak has first-choice access to the overall arsenal of best-of-the-best First Age personal weapons and armor systems.  Can you say a medley of 5 dot artifacts would be covering him from head to toe should he actually be encountered?  Along with knowing most or all of the Sidereal Charms and Martial Arts, he will have a variety of Celestial Manses, I would guess two or three 5 dot Manses just to start with, and others to run/augment various artifacts.


Even if all of this could somehow be overcome (I don't believe it), I personally believe one of the Maidens (or a collection of other very high level gods) would show up right before his demise and politely ask everyone to leave him be, followed by escorting him to safety or escorting the Solars off the premises (depending).  Those high-level connections can be useful beyond compare.


Any move the Gold Faction could accomplish to undermine Kejak's position would be countered by three from the Bronze Faction, netting a positive position increase for Kejak.


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In order for Kejak to be killed off or executed:


1 -- He would have to be caught out and away from all defenses and protections (something that will never happen IMO).


2 -- A fundamental shift in the atmosphere of Kejak's power in Yu-Shan would be necessary.  A conviction on a Severity 5 offense or several Severity 4 offenses, perhaps.  Getting successfully accused of plotting against the Celestial Incarna in a mad power-grab for the Games of Divinity, maybe.  (Even a lot of "dirt" on Kejak would be useless.  In all honesty, the plight of creation and what Kejak has been doing is basically common knowledge in Yu-Shan.  The Celestial Incarna have tacitly approved of it all and are unlikely to dramatically reverse themselves.)


3 -- The Celestials carve out some time from the Games of Divinity and work on administrative matters in Yu-Shan . . . and somehow they all decide that they didn't really like what Kejak has been doing all along.  This would also have a positive effect on Creation as the Censors would suddenly be required to actually do their job some of them, etc.  (Stop laughing, it could happen . . . ok, I don't believe it, either.)


4 -- Perhaps some mass grass-roots uprising of spirits in Yu-Shan instigated by Gold Faction Sidereals and Solar infiltrators?  Nah, there are too many spirits who would rush off to the lions, the major gods, or the Celestials in the hopes of major rewards or even being allowed a move in the Games themselves (whether they'd actually get one is quite another matter).


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As for the poll, I did not select an option because I don't believe it would be possible outside of arbitrary Deus ex Machina.

 

[Jukashi]

Of course, we're all forgetting something about ol' Ketchup.

 

[Persell]

after the solars topple the realm and find out everything and stabilize everything ' date=' how should Kejak Die.[/quote']
What makes you think the Solars will topple the Realm, find out everything and stabilize everything?  Maybe they'll do what old Kejak foresaw they would do and destroy it before then.

 

[Flagg]

Maybe they'll do what old Kejak foresaw they would do and destroy it before then.

To be fair, he foresaw that there was a 33.333...% chance of this.


-S

 

[X-Salted]

Pardon me for asking but can someone give me a brief refresher on who Kejak is and which book can I find him? Its been a while since I last read about him.   :?

 

[Persell]

Maybe they'll do what old Kejak foresaw they would do and destroy it before then.

To be fair, he foresaw that there was a 33.333...% chance of this.


-S

Isn't it more like 50% that the Solars would destroy Creation?


Natural course - 33.3% destruction of Creation


Bronze option (successful) - 16.6% Creation saved


Bronze option (unsuccessful) - 16.6% destruction of Creation


Gold option - 33.3% Creation saved


Kejak is the leader of the Sidereal Bronze Faction that proposed the destruction of the Solars and the imprisonment of their Essences.  He's talked about greatly in the Sidereal book.

 

[stubs20]

Maybe they'll do what old Kejak foresaw they would do and destroy it before then.

To be fair, he foresaw that there was a 33.333...% chance of this.


-S

Isn't it more like 50% that the Solars would destroy Creation?


Natural course - 33.3% destruction of Creation


Bronze option (successful) - 16.6% Creation saved


Bronze option (unsuccessful) - 16.6% destruction of Creation


Gold option - 33.3% Creation saved


Kejak is the leader of the Sidereal Bronze Faction that proposed the destruction of the Solars and the imprisonment of their Essences.  He's talked about greatly in the Sidereal book.

Not quite...


The Sidereals chose their choice due to it being the easiest and safest path. So I think it would be more...


Natural course - 33.4% destruction of Creation


Bronze option (successful) - 25% Creation saved


Bronze option (unsuccessful) - 25% destruction of Creation


Gold option - 16.6% Creation saved


I would have still gone Gold

 

[Persell]

Blah.  I must have just smoked crack when I posted that.  It should be the other way around.


Also, I was going by the pure math of it.  They foresaw 3 futures.  The Natural Course had one definite ending, the Bronze option had one definite ending, and the Gold option had two possible endings.


Natural course - 33.3% destruction of Creation


Gold option (unsuccessful) - 16.6% destruction of Creation


Gold option (successful) - 16.6% Creation saved  


Bronze option - 33.3% Creation saved


The future the Sidereals could have forged if they didn't suffer hubris and tunnel-vision - 0.02%

 

[Solfi]

He should age & die listening to endless Immaculate Sermons.


... or possible through some infinitely ironic (and sad) twist of fate (and it would have to be some seriously insidious shit to affect this Grand Poobah of Destiny).

 

[Flagg]

He's pretty close to dying naturally anyway. By the time the Solars are likely to even get near him, he'd probably have died in this sleep.


-S

 

[Cthulhu_Wakes]

Someone who agrees! Thank Heavens!

 

[Kremlin KOA]

Personally the best ending would be for a major invasion by the Deathlords that ALMOST wipes out creation and Kejak dies of old age seeing the Solars save creation from the very doom he created.


In the end the ultimate doom of creation was MADE by Kejak


His decision to destroy the Solars created the Deathlords and Abyssals, before then, the Neverborn were semi toothless and could have been dealt with over time.


The Sidereals created the very doom they were trying to avoid.


There is no death painful enough for what is essentially Lucifer.


I chose Crucifixion because it is the most torturous death in the list (most torturous ine nvented by man before the 20th century.

 

[Flagg]

chose Crucifixion because it is the most torturous death in the list (most torturous ine nvented by man before the 20th century.

And probably ineffective against Exalts, especially ones of his power. Think about it.


-S

 

[Jukashi]

Heck, a firing squad would probably be ineffective.

 

[Persell]

Personally the best ending would be for a major invasion by the Deathlords that ALMOST wipes out creation and Kejak dies of old age seeing the Solars save creation from the very doom he created.

Why would the Solars, who are only about 5 years into their power, be able to stop an invasion by the Deathlords that the Sidereals wouldn't be able to stop, who have been around for 2,000 years and less?

In the end the ultimate doom of creation was MADE by Kejak

Quite untrue.

His decision to destroy the Solars created the Deathlords and Abyssals' date=' before then, the Neverborn were semi toothless and could have been dealt with over time.[/quote']
While the Sidereals did slaughter the Solars during the Usurpation and some of the ghosts of those Solars decided to become thralls to the Neverborn to become Deathlords, it was those ghosts who made the decision to become Deathlords, not the Sidereals.  For the ghosts to choose to become Deathlords they would have had to become quite evil to begin with, evil enough to be able to destroy Creation as living Solars.

The Sidereals created the very doom they were trying to avoid.

No they didn't.  The doom that they were trying to avoid was one where the Solars destroyed Creation.  They didn't foresee the threat that the Underworld posed to Creation.  Before you get on their asses about that, though, don't forget that the Solars wouldn't have either.

There is no death painful enough for what is essentially Lucifer.

Lucifer rebelled because, in his pride, he thought that he was more worthy of ruling the Universe than God.  Kejak, on the other hand, rebelled against the Solars because the Solars threatened to destroy Creation and, in his and his fellows hubris, didn't think to forge a different future.  There's a big difference.

 

[Kremlin KOA]

In his pride he thought his vision of the best possible future was the only true one


who am I talking about?

 

[Persell]

In his pride he thought his vision of the best possible future was the only true one
who am I talking about?

No.  He thought that the best possible future of the three he saw in which Creation could continue to exist was the one future in which the Solars were all killed.  It wasn't his vision to kill all the Solars.  That future was shown to all the Sidereals, not just him.  Therefore he wasn't out to kill the Solars and used the Great Prophecy as an excuse to do so.  Rather, he, like every other Sidereal, were out to protect Creation.  He just felt that the best way to do so would be to kill the Solars.  Big difference.

 

[Kremlin KOA]

you presumed I was talking about Kejak... ever thought I was referencing Lucifer right then?


the smple fact, is that the decisions made by Kejak and co were merely a result of the blind Arrogance that is their version of the Great Curse.


Their ability to see the future is clouded by that arrogance, when they got that vision they could have asked the 5 maidens, Gaia, Luna, or even the US for help... instead they waged terrible war on their own authority because they could not comprehend that they could be wrong


THEY created the angry ghosts that became the deathlords


THEY failed to ever admit that the dead were a force that prophecy could not take into account (except ragon king prophecy... but hey)


THEY failed to forsee the fair folk invasion, and failed to admit that it wa beyond their power to forsee


THEY failed to safeguard those captive esences, allowing fully half of them to be given to forces hell bent on destroying creation


in the end, their decision destroyed over half of creation, and caused, directly or indirectly, the creation of forces whose sole goal is the destruction of all creation.


But they are always right, just ask one.

 

[Persell]

you presumed I was talking about Kejak... ever thought I was referencing Lucifer right then?
the smple fact, is that the decisions made by Kejak and co were merely a result of the blind Arrogance that is their version of the Great Curse.

True...  But the destruction that threatens Creations by the Solars is a result of their Great Curse.  Why not put some responsibility on them?

Their ability to see the future is clouded by that arrogance' date=' when they got that vision they could have asked the 5 maidens, Gaia, Luna, or even the US for help... instead they waged terrible war on their own authority because they could not comprehend that they could be wrong[/quote']
Just as the Solars could not comprehend they could be wrong in the vile deeds they did during the First Age.

THEY created the angry ghosts that became the deathlords

True, the Sidereals killed the Solars whose ghosts would become the Deathlords, but it was the choice of those individual ghosts to become so vile and evil as to make Creation fall into Oblivion.  Kejak never forced those ghosts to become Deathlords.

THEY failed to ever admit that the dead were a force that prophecy could not take into account (except ragon king prophecy... but hey)

Yes, because the dead were never a force that seemed to be able to threaten Creation.  That's not their fault - I'm sure the Solars didn't think much of the dead either.

THEY failed to forsee the fair folk invasion' date=' and failed to admit that it wa beyond their power to forsee[/quote']
No, I'm pretty sure they admit that it's beyond their ability to foresee now.  Now they take very careful steps to ensure it won't happen again.  Sidereals are arrogant, not stupid.

THEY failed to safeguard those captive esences' date=' allowing fully half of them to be given to forces hell bent on destroying creation[/quote']
Well sinking them to the bottom of the Inner Sea seems to be pretty secure.  Do you see what it took to retrieve it?  They didn't exactly leave the Jade Prison out in the open.

in the end' date=' their decision destroyed over half of creation, and caused, directly or indirectly, the creation of forces whose sole goal is the destruction of all creation.[/quote']
Better that half of Creation be destroyed by other forces than all of Creation by the Solars.  And the Sidereals didn't create those other forces.  The Yozis and Neverborn have always been around to destroy Creation.

 

[Kremlin KOA]

you miss the point


they forsaw those futures because their form of divination is flawed


they can only see what the future WOULD be if there were no fair folk, dead, or Yozi demons in it