cyl
Creepy smile
Anything shiny and/or overpowered you had in mind... let it be sanctified here !
[Custom] Hands of the Renewal [Alliance of the Renewal]
- Thread starter cyl
- Start date
saganite
Two Thousand Club
About the stats for Metagalpan great Hawks listed in Scavenger Sons... They are supposed to be representative of Hawks reaching up to 30 feet (a little more than 9 meters) in wingspan. Strix, in comparison, have a wingspan of up to around 15 feet (or about 4.5 meters). However, if you compare the stats for both, Strix are much better. While in some ways its not completely unbelievable, I cannot understand how it can be considerably stronger and tougher than a similar creature twice its size (especially when they are both of similar place in the food chain and neither is a predator or natural enemy of the other).
Anyways, /rant, I was wondering if we could change the statistics for a typical Metagalpan Hawk (or even just for my character's, considering his is supposed to be one of the greatest of its species >_>) to bring it up to a more fitting power level.
Anyways, /rant, I was wondering if we could change the statistics for a typical Metagalpan Hawk (or even just for my character's, considering his is supposed to be one of the greatest of its species >_>) to bring it up to a more fitting power level.
cyl
Creepy smile
:Leans forward: I knew you'd say that.
Yup, that's fine with me.
The characteristics of the Strix are quite adapted, maybe +2 to dex -1 to stam for the Hawk.
Yup, that's fine with me.
The characteristics of the Strix are quite adapted, maybe +2 to dex -1 to stam for the Hawk.
saganite
Two Thousand Club
Hehehe 
Hmm... So as far as the Dexterity and Stamina change you're suggesting, are we talking about the base statistics for the Hawk as listed in Scavenger Sons or altering those of the Strix listed in the Core for the Hawk? 'Cause the former would seem to be counterproductive >_>. The latter I was not immediately too fond of, but after a bit of reading it does seem that Owls (the Strix's real-life cousin) are usually more muscular than hawks, so I suppose it's understandable that even when the Metagalpan Hawk is that much larger than the Strix the hawk may not have considerably more physical strength and stamina than the smaller bird.
EDIT: Bah, I misread your post. So we are adapting the stats of the Strix to fit the Metagalpan War Hawks, fair enough.
After a little more reading, I've realized that your suggestion of +2 Dexterity and -1 Stamina is great, as Hawks are naturally much quicker than Owls because they lack the necessary physical traits to hunt at night. They've gotta be speedy little devils to be able to swoop down and catch prey in the middle of the day . The -1 Stamina is great for showing how, despite their great size, the Hawks have lower endurance than their avian cousins, which is why the denizens of Metagalpa are usually limited in how far they can travel from the aviaries (Solar Charms have changed that 
).
However, I have a few more suggestions for stat changes that would help distinguish the Hawks better. I personally feel like increasing their Strength by one would help define their greater size better, all the while still showing how the smaller Strix are still quite strong in a compact way, as Owls are in the real world. Also, Owls are generally a little more cunning than Hawks, so lowering the Intelligence to 2 would also help set the Metagalpan Hawks apart. Going by comparison between the Scavenger Sons Metagalpan Hawk and the Corebook Strix, the Hawk has one extra -2 and -4 health level each and one less -0, so those differences might be good to replicate as well.
As far as Abilities go, I feel like some of the differences between the Scavenger Sons Hawk and the Strix make sense, and others don't. Comparing the 1e Strix with its 2e version, the 2e writeup has several abilities the 1e didn't possess. These would be Investigation, Integrity, Presence, Resistance, and Survival. The SS Hawk writeup has Presence (with the Intimidation +2 specialty as well), but none of the others. I think it would be fair to assume that it possess all of those in similar capacity. As far as those three go, here's my take on them:
Investigation 3: no change really necessary here
Integrity 4: Metagalpan Hawks are bred and raised individually, resulting in incredibly loyal companions
Presence 3 (Intimidation +2): again, no change necessary here
Resistance 2: considered lowering this to 1, but that seems unnecessary
Survival 2: lowered, as the Hawks are more reliant on the care of their handlers than the wild Strix; though, they still possess instinctual habits they could use to survive if forced back into the wild; this might be lowered even further, your call
To separate the Hawks even further from the Strix, I think lowering their Stealth score considerably (or even dropping it entirely) makes sense. Stealth is a central aspect of the hunting techniques of Owls. Many Hawks, including the Red-Tailed (which I think the Metagalpan Hawks might be based off of), are much more conspicuous in their hunting, instead relying on great speed. As far as the other Abilities go, I feel like using the values as listed in SS instead of the Strix 2e Core scores would be good for showing how the hawks have grown up in pseudo-captivity rather than the wilds, so they haven't learned as much as they might have in their natural setting. The only ability I feel that it would make sense to retain at its original value would be Martial Arts. These Hawks are bred for war, so it makes little sense that they'd have a diminished score. The specialty probably isn't necessary though.
As far as attack modes go, through calculations using the SS Hawk writeup and some common sense, I've determined them to be:
Claw: Speed 6, Accuracy +1, Damage +4L, Defense +0, Rate 2 (taken from Mospid writeup in 2e Core)
Beak: Speed 6, Accuracy -1, Damage +0L, Defense -3, Rate 1
(EDIT: I should have mentioned this before, these are the attack modes in their base form, before the addition of bonuses from Attributes and Abilities)
As far as soak goes, by the listing in SS they gain an extra 1B/1L from their hide.
So, how does all of this sound? All of this is merely suggestion, of course the executive decision is yours.
Hmm... So as far as the Dexterity and Stamina change you're suggesting, are we talking about the base statistics for the Hawk as listed in Scavenger Sons or altering those of the Strix listed in the Core for the Hawk? 'Cause the former would seem to be counterproductive >_>. The latter I was not immediately too fond of, but after a bit of reading it does seem that Owls (the Strix's real-life cousin) are usually more muscular than hawks, so I suppose it's understandable that even when the Metagalpan Hawk is that much larger than the Strix the hawk may not have considerably more physical strength and stamina than the smaller bird.
EDIT: Bah, I misread your post. So we are adapting the stats of the Strix to fit the Metagalpan War Hawks, fair enough.
After a little more reading, I've realized that your suggestion of +2 Dexterity and -1 Stamina is great, as Hawks are naturally much quicker than Owls because they lack the necessary physical traits to hunt at night. They've gotta be speedy little devils to be able to swoop down and catch prey in the middle of the day
. The -1 Stamina is great for showing how, despite their great size, the Hawks have lower endurance than their avian cousins, which is why the denizens of Metagalpa are usually limited in how far they can travel from the aviaries (Solar Charms have changed that ).However, I have a few more suggestions for stat changes that would help distinguish the Hawks better. I personally feel like increasing their Strength by one would help define their greater size better, all the while still showing how the smaller Strix are still quite strong in a compact way, as Owls are in the real world. Also, Owls are generally a little more cunning than Hawks, so lowering the Intelligence to 2 would also help set the Metagalpan Hawks apart. Going by comparison between the Scavenger Sons Metagalpan Hawk and the Corebook Strix, the Hawk has one extra -2 and -4 health level each and one less -0, so those differences might be good to replicate as well.
As far as Abilities go, I feel like some of the differences between the Scavenger Sons Hawk and the Strix make sense, and others don't. Comparing the 1e Strix with its 2e version, the 2e writeup has several abilities the 1e didn't possess. These would be Investigation, Integrity, Presence, Resistance, and Survival. The SS Hawk writeup has Presence (with the Intimidation +2 specialty as well), but none of the others. I think it would be fair to assume that it possess all of those in similar capacity. As far as those three go, here's my take on them:
Investigation 3: no change really necessary here
Integrity 4: Metagalpan Hawks are bred and raised individually, resulting in incredibly loyal companions
Presence 3 (Intimidation +2): again, no change necessary here
Resistance 2: considered lowering this to 1, but that seems unnecessary
Survival 2: lowered, as the Hawks are more reliant on the care of their handlers than the wild Strix; though, they still possess instinctual habits they could use to survive if forced back into the wild; this might be lowered even further, your call
To separate the Hawks even further from the Strix, I think lowering their Stealth score considerably (or even dropping it entirely) makes sense. Stealth is a central aspect of the hunting techniques of Owls. Many Hawks, including the Red-Tailed (which I think the Metagalpan Hawks might be based off of), are much more conspicuous in their hunting, instead relying on great speed. As far as the other Abilities go, I feel like using the values as listed in SS instead of the Strix 2e Core scores would be good for showing how the hawks have grown up in pseudo-captivity rather than the wilds, so they haven't learned as much as they might have in their natural setting. The only ability I feel that it would make sense to retain at its original value would be Martial Arts. These Hawks are bred for war, so it makes little sense that they'd have a diminished score. The specialty probably isn't necessary though.
As far as attack modes go, through calculations using the SS Hawk writeup and some common sense, I've determined them to be:
Claw: Speed 6, Accuracy +1, Damage +4L, Defense +0, Rate 2 (taken from Mospid writeup in 2e Core)
Beak: Speed 6, Accuracy -1, Damage +0L, Defense -3, Rate 1
(EDIT: I should have mentioned this before, these are the attack modes in their base form, before the addition of bonuses from Attributes and Abilities)
As far as soak goes, by the listing in SS they gain an extra 1B/1L from their hide.
So, how does all of this sound? All of this is merely suggestion, of course the executive decision is yours.
Odin1
New Member
Bladeshine always needs shiny, so... How about asking you to start the game with a couple God Charms? My meager Essence 2 won't allow me to get the overpowered stuff out there (Principle of Motion, I'm looking at you), but I coudl always use a level of Essence Plethora and maybe Measure the Wind... I thought this could reflect her early Enlightening and the exacting training by her mother
Coyotekin
Catalytic Diplomat
Cyl, what about that weapon I mentioned?
cyl
Creepy smile
Got work to do this morning, I'll try to answer everything more precisely in the afternoon or this evening :wink:
lockepick
New Member
Resolute Ends (Artifact ****)
Based off Orichalcum Grand Dailkaive
Speed: 5
Accuracy: +5
Damage: +14L/4
Defense: +2
Rate: 3
Commit: 10
Tags: 2, O, P, R
Hearthstone Slots: 3
The Lawgivers are destined to be noble leaders; and even the Dawn Caste are meant to be generals only when no other option is available against the forces of darkness. For as long as the sword is not drawn, the Lawgiver gains a +3 to Charisma and Manipulation checks. Should war be the only possible answer, the Lawgiver can not be the one to initiate aggression. In combat, the Lawgiver gains the effect of a persistent Ready in Eight Directions, and gives the Lawgiver the ability to use Iron Whirlwind Attack is an innate ability, with the modification from Invincible Fury of the Dawn. If the Lawgiver draws his weapon BEFORE an enemy draws his own (or otherwise initiates combat for martial artists); all effects are lost until the next sunrise. If the Lawgiver ever uses this weapon to strike down a defenseless target, all benefits are lost for a month.
Based off Orichalcum Grand Dailkaive
Speed: 5
Accuracy: +5
Damage: +14L/4
Defense: +2
Rate: 3
Commit: 10
Tags: 2, O, P, R
Hearthstone Slots: 3
The Lawgivers are destined to be noble leaders; and even the Dawn Caste are meant to be generals only when no other option is available against the forces of darkness. For as long as the sword is not drawn, the Lawgiver gains a +3 to Charisma and Manipulation checks. Should war be the only possible answer, the Lawgiver can not be the one to initiate aggression. In combat, the Lawgiver gains the effect of a persistent Ready in Eight Directions, and gives the Lawgiver the ability to use Iron Whirlwind Attack is an innate ability, with the modification from Invincible Fury of the Dawn. If the Lawgiver draws his weapon BEFORE an enemy draws his own (or otherwise initiates combat for martial artists); all effects are lost until the next sunrise. If the Lawgiver ever uses this weapon to strike down a defenseless target, all benefits are lost for a month.
saganite
Two Thousand Club
God Damn. >_<
Sorry, but there's no way that can be Artifact 4.
Sorry, but there's no way that can be Artifact 4.
Coyotekin
Catalytic Diplomat
Sorry lock, but that is easily an N/A Artifact because it does more than a Level 5 artifact does. Might want to do some comparisons, maybe to the Daiklaive of Conquest as an example, or maybe even Soul Mirror.
saganite
Two Thousand Club
Soul Mirror is a very high-end Artifact 5.. I think the Daiklave of Conquest is a good example of a middle-ranged Artifact 5.
Speaking of Artifacts... cyl, what do you think of Artifact Armor as printed in the Core? More specifically, the Artifact ratings associated with each set? I ask this because there are some out there, myself included, who believe that the written ratings seem to be too high for the overall utility of the armor. >_>
Speaking of Artifacts... cyl, what do you think of Artifact Armor as printed in the Core? More specifically, the Artifact ratings associated with each set? I ask this because there are some out there, myself included, who believe that the written ratings seem to be too high for the overall utility of the armor. >_>
cyl
Creepy smile
I'm gonna start with the quickest answer:
Odin: measure the wind's ok, Essence Plethora, I have to think about it... anyways thoose will be bought as bonus charms with BP (as per the rules of BP).
Coyotekin: your weapons seems cool, but I need more something more material to approve it.
lockepick: the concept is interesting, but the rating is inappropriated.
- first the attribute bonuses qualify it for a good 4dot artifact.
- the permanent use of Ri8S qualify it for a regular 5dot artifact (because it has no cost, but it has a condition)
- the reflexive use of IWA+IFotD qualify it for a regular 5dot (you still need to have the charms to use them)
- the last condition also means you cannot kill someone you downed to incapacitated. (in my games, a person doesn't die first, he falls to incapacitated, and bleed, but if you want to kill him you have to get him a finishing blow... unless you have several attacks in the same action)
fhgwdads05: yes the artifact armor are a bit overrated. Have to work on that, tell me what model are you interested in (I might lower the rating by 1 or 2 dot)... else I'm working on the Great Hawk stats.
Odin: measure the wind's ok, Essence Plethora, I have to think about it... anyways thoose will be bought as bonus charms with BP (as per the rules of BP).
Coyotekin: your weapons seems cool, but I need more something more material to approve it.
lockepick: the concept is interesting, but the rating is inappropriated.
- first the attribute bonuses qualify it for a good 4dot artifact.
- the permanent use of Ri8S qualify it for a regular 5dot artifact (because it has no cost, but it has a condition)
- the reflexive use of IWA+IFotD qualify it for a regular 5dot (you still need to have the charms to use them)
- the last condition also means you cannot kill someone you downed to incapacitated. (in my games, a person doesn't die first, he falls to incapacitated, and bleed, but if you want to kill him you have to get him a finishing blow... unless you have several attacks in the same action)
fhgwdads05: yes the artifact armor are a bit overrated. Have to work on that, tell me what model are you interested in (I might lower the rating by 1 or 2 dot)... else I'm working on the Great Hawk stats.
saganite
Two Thousand Club
Please excuse my dissent, but to be honest, making Iron Whirlwind Attack an innate power breaks the game pretty bad. Much more than even a 5-dot artifact should. It's really, really, not something that should exist. Ever.
Anyhoo, I might have gone for a Reinforced Breastplate if I had the spare dots, but I probably won't unless the costs are changed. Here's what I believe to be a very good set of changes to Artifact Armor that Plague of Hats, from the White-Wolf Wiki and Forum, suggested:
• Breastplate: Commitment: 1
• Chain Shirt: Commitment: 1
• Lamellar: Commitment: 2
• Reinforced Buff Jacket: Commitment: 2
•• Reinforced Breastplate: Commitment: 4
••• Articulated Plate: Commitment: 6
••• Superheavy Plate: Commitment: 9
As far as the Greath Hawk stats, did you see the whole bunch of suggestions and thoughts I posted farther up?
Anyhoo, I might have gone for a Reinforced Breastplate if I had the spare dots, but I probably won't unless the costs are changed. Here's what I believe to be a very good set of changes to Artifact Armor that Plague of Hats, from the White-Wolf Wiki and Forum, suggested:
• Breastplate: Commitment: 1
• Chain Shirt: Commitment: 1
• Lamellar: Commitment: 2
• Reinforced Buff Jacket: Commitment: 2
•• Reinforced Breastplate: Commitment: 4
••• Articulated Plate: Commitment: 6
••• Superheavy Plate: Commitment: 9
As far as the Greath Hawk stats, did you see the whole bunch of suggestions and thoughts I posted farther up?
cyl
Creepy smile
No offense taken. But I disagree, if it's the artifact's only power, the innate use of IWA doesn't break anything IMHO, it merely allows the character to gain 1wp not using a combo... in the end, it still costs motes and WP, so a pc will drain himself out of willpower if he uses this power too much... of course it makes him an awesome fighter in the short run. This power may be more suited for less powerful weapons.
I agree with the changes in the armor (gonna put it in the rules addenda).
For the Hawk, yes I read it.
So here's my call:
Warhawk:
phys: 9/5/7
Soc: 3/1/3 (yes it needs social attributes... how's he gonna use presence if it doesn't)
Ment: 4(hawks have excellent sight and smell)/2/3
Willpower 6 (war beasts)
Abilities:
Athletics 2,
Awareness 3,
Dodge 4 (they are faster and more agile than owls),
Integrity 4 (they are bred as war mounts),
(they don't need investigation at all, since they are fed, no real need to hunt preys looking for their nests),
Presence 3 (intimidation+2)
Martial Arts 4 (they use beak claws and grabs so no specialisation needed),
Resistance 2 (if less resistant than the stryx, they are still trained as war mounts),
Stealth 1 (well they're still birds of prey)
Soak: 3L/7B
HL: as original warhawk
Attacks:
Claws as you stated
Beak: speed 5
Grab: speed 6 acc 13, dmg 9B, def 1 (yep they are trained to grab horses or people in war).
fine with you ?
I agree with the changes in the armor (gonna put it in the rules addenda).
For the Hawk, yes I read it.
So here's my call:
Warhawk:
phys: 9/5/7
Soc: 3/1/3 (yes it needs social attributes... how's he gonna use presence if it doesn't)
Ment: 4(hawks have excellent sight and smell)/2/3
Willpower 6 (war beasts)
Abilities:
Athletics 2,
Awareness 3,
Dodge 4 (they are faster and more agile than owls),
Integrity 4 (they are bred as war mounts),
(they don't need investigation at all, since they are fed, no real need to hunt preys looking for their nests),
Presence 3 (intimidation+2)
Martial Arts 4 (they use beak claws and grabs so no specialisation needed),
Resistance 2 (if less resistant than the stryx, they are still trained as war mounts),
Stealth 1 (well they're still birds of prey)
Soak: 3L/7B
HL: as original warhawk
Attacks:
Claws as you stated
Beak: speed 5
Grab: speed 6 acc 13, dmg 9B, def 1 (yep they are trained to grab horses or people in war).
fine with you ?
saganite
Two Thousand Club
Hm... I suppose.. But to be honest, it doesn't really seem like a very flavorful artifact ability. Personally, I don't feel like Artifact powers should interact with specific Charms in the way its listed there. Having a power similar to an existing Charm, such as a persistent effect that replicates Ready in Eight Directions Stance, seems pretty kosher. Having, say, a Sword that decreases the cost of using Glorious Solar Saber and makes its effects stack on your Sword's stats (an extreme example, but one nonetheless >_>) seems out of line to me in principle, before even considering power.
Anyhoo..
Thanks for the Armor changes.
The Hawk looks great to me. Good call with the Social attributes, that's definitely something necessary that I wasn't thinking about . >_<
Hmm... The accuracy for the Grab seems a little too much. The writeup for the Strix in the 2e Core has Grab at +0 Accuracy base (pool of 9, Dex 3 + MA 4 + Grab Spec 2). Raising up the base Accuracy by four miiight be a little too good. I'd honestly just leave it at +0, so the Grab would be at 9 dice, just as with Strix. Grabs are meant to function like Clinches, right?
Anyhoo..
Thanks for the Armor changes.
The Hawk looks great to me. Good call with the Social attributes, that's definitely something necessary that I wasn't thinking about . >_<
Hmm... The accuracy for the Grab seems a little too much. The writeup for the Strix in the 2e Core has Grab at +0 Accuracy base (pool of 9, Dex 3 + MA 4 + Grab Spec 2). Raising up the base Accuracy by four miiight be a little too good.
I'd honestly just leave it at +0, so the Grab would be at 9 dice, just as with Strix. Grabs are meant to function like Clinches, right?
cyl
Creepy smile
huh, actually the 13 is the actual grab dicepool... 9str+4MA. and yes they work like clinches, I am also working on a dive attack, considering it is going to replicate the charge mechanism for both claws and grabs.
saganite
Two Thousand Club
Ooooh. I thought Strength was only used in maintaining Clinches, not starting them?
Yeah, I'm definitely down for a Dive mechanic. The Metagalpan War Hawks are supposed to be able to dive at speeds upwards of 120 miles per hour (so 70-80 km/h), and I definitely would like to make use of that. >_>
Yeah, I'm definitely down for a Dive mechanic. The Metagalpan War Hawks are supposed to be able to dive at speeds upwards of 120 miles per hour (so 70-80 km/h), and I definitely would like to make use of that. >_>
cyl
Creepy smile
Corebook p.157 (part of the reason why lunars were overpowered in 1ed) grappling attack str/dex + MAfhgwdads05 said:
saganite
Two Thousand Club
Ah, you're right. Damn scary it'll be. :twisted:
Coyotekin
Catalytic Diplomat
War's Bounty, the weapon I mentioned before, is what I want to work on.
The basic idea I have had so far is a Scythe that has the ability to become several different weapons.
1) Scythe
2) Dual-Bladed Scythe
3) Split into a pair of large-bladed Kamas (Sickles)
4) Staff
The moonsilver was there mainly to represent the shifting nature of a weapon. I have thought about combining the bonuses of both MMs in whatever weapon form it is in at the time. And at the commitment cost of of the highest weapon's (Grimscythe) attunement cost based on Orichalcum only instead of a doubled cost for different MM.
What would you think this Artifact would be rated at?
The basic idea I have had so far is a Scythe that has the ability to become several different weapons.
1) Scythe
2) Dual-Bladed Scythe
3) Split into a pair of large-bladed Kamas (Sickles)
4) Staff
The moonsilver was there mainly to represent the shifting nature of a weapon. I have thought about combining the bonuses of both MMs in whatever weapon form it is in at the time. And at the commitment cost of of the highest weapon's (Grimscythe) attunement cost based on Orichalcum only instead of a doubled cost for different MM.
What would you think this Artifact would be rated at?
lockepick
New Member
Most of my ideas were based off of Oadonel's Codex, also, off the idea of stacking smaller effects together.
lockepick: the concept is interesting, but the rating is inappropriated.
- first the attribute bonuses qualify it for a good 4dot artifact.
According to OC; gaining a +3 to Attributes is a 3-dot ability. Also, there is a 2-dot Manse that does +2 to Charisma/Manipulation.
- the permanent use of Ri8S qualify it for a regular 5dot artifact (because it has no cost, but it has a condition)
Ri8S is an E2 charm; by OC, that is something 1-dot and 2-dot artifacts cover. I am willing to either A) make it no longer persistent or B) drop it all together.
- the reflexive use of IWA+IFotD qualify it for a regular 5dot (you still need to have the charms to use them)
I don't think I understand what you mean here? A 4-dot artifact allows you to mimic E4 or E5 charms; IFotD is an E4 charm and IWA is an E2 charm. I figured the smaller effects would stack together to create an effect equaling one E5 charm.
- the last condition also means you cannot kill someone you downed to incapacitated. (in my games, a person doesn't die first, he falls to incapacitated, and bleed, but if you want to kill him you have to get him a finishing blow... unless you have several attacks in the same action)
Does this mean you're not using the traditional dying health level system? I understood this meant I could kill a guy who was bleeding out; it was meant to be a large setback.
Let me know how you feel about the counter points, or how you'd feel with me making this 5-dot versus 4-dot.
lockepick: the concept is interesting, but the rating is inappropriated.
- first the attribute bonuses qualify it for a good 4dot artifact.
According to OC; gaining a +3 to Attributes is a 3-dot ability. Also, there is a 2-dot Manse that does +2 to Charisma/Manipulation.
- the permanent use of Ri8S qualify it for a regular 5dot artifact (because it has no cost, but it has a condition)
Ri8S is an E2 charm; by OC, that is something 1-dot and 2-dot artifacts cover. I am willing to either A) make it no longer persistent or B) drop it all together.
- the reflexive use of IWA+IFotD qualify it for a regular 5dot (you still need to have the charms to use them)
I don't think I understand what you mean here? A 4-dot artifact allows you to mimic E4 or E5 charms; IFotD is an E4 charm and IWA is an E2 charm. I figured the smaller effects would stack together to create an effect equaling one E5 charm.
- the last condition also means you cannot kill someone you downed to incapacitated. (in my games, a person doesn't die first, he falls to incapacitated, and bleed, but if you want to kill him you have to get him a finishing blow... unless you have several attacks in the same action)
Does this mean you're not using the traditional dying health level system? I understood this meant I could kill a guy who was bleeding out; it was meant to be a large setback.
Let me know how you feel about the counter points, or how you'd feel with me making this 5-dot versus 4-dot.
cyl
Creepy smile
You seem to forget you are talking about a Great Daiklave, which is already a 3-dot artifact...
You were not talking about charm replication, but permanent innate use of a charm... which actually gives you scene long ability to make counterattacks.
That is what I stated... when the OC says "artifact 4 duplicates E2-5 charm" it does not mean Great Daiklave duplicating E5 charms... the great klave is already a powerful 3dot artifact... adding a singular power is sufficient to make it a 4dot artifact, see Soul Mirror and the other 4dot/5dot artifact in the OC.
Even at 5dot I cannot consider letting you take all these powers.
I would consent on the bonus to social traits + the scene long counterattack as both have a condition/limitation.
saganite
Two Thousand Club
First off...
To be honest lockepick, what you have here seems like a mishmash of powers. Every good artifact has a central theme that ties everything about it together. They need to more than just die-adders and powers. Charms can do that. Oadenol's Codex goes over this. Now, as far as theme, the Daiklave of Conquest, for example, is a weapon for the greatest of all generals. What's yours, and how do each of the powers and disadvantages tie into that?
Now, as mentioned in Oadenol's Codex, yes, adding +3 to an attribute is a 3-dot ability. +3 to a single attribute, not several. It's also a very boring ability. But that's besides the fact. The Hearthstone you mention is different, as Manses do not usually suffer nearly as much plot immunity as Artifacts do. You can lose your Hearthstone if some random punk goes and smashes up the interior of your Manse with a Sledge (not that that might actually happen, but it's a plausible worst-case scenario). Artifacts don't suffer that weakness most of the time.
Yes, Ri8S is an Essence 2 Charm, and yes, by OC 2-dot Artifacts usually cover this. However, this would be an artifact that does this and this alone. And it would still have an activation cost, and still have the same duration.
The same logic applies to IWA + IFotD. When you combine all of this with an already quite potent 3-dot Artifact, the Grand Daiklave, it becomes very, very powerful.
To be honest lockepick, what you have here seems like a mishmash of powers. Every good artifact has a central theme that ties everything about it together. They need to more than just die-adders and powers. Charms can do that. Oadenol's Codex goes over this. Now, as far as theme, the Daiklave of Conquest, for example, is a weapon for the greatest of all generals. What's yours, and how do each of the powers and disadvantages tie into that?
Now, as mentioned in Oadenol's Codex, yes, adding +3 to an attribute is a 3-dot ability. +3 to a single attribute, not several. It's also a very boring ability. But that's besides the fact. The Hearthstone you mention is different, as Manses do not usually suffer nearly as much plot immunity as Artifacts do. You can lose your Hearthstone if some random punk goes and smashes up the interior of your Manse with a Sledge (not that that might actually happen, but it's a plausible worst-case scenario). Artifacts don't suffer that weakness most of the time.
Yes, Ri8S is an Essence 2 Charm, and yes, by OC 2-dot Artifacts usually cover this. However, this would be an artifact that does this and this alone. And it would still have an activation cost, and still have the same duration.
The same logic applies to IWA + IFotD. When you combine all of this with an already quite potent 3-dot Artifact, the Grand Daiklave, it becomes very, very powerful.
Coyotekin
Catalytic Diplomat
:clears throat: Why has my artifact been ignored both in here and in PM?
saganite
Two Thousand Club
And our ST already beat me to it. :roll:
EDIT: Where's your artifact Coyote? >_>
EDIT: Where's your artifact Coyote? >_>