What the future holds

[Haku1]

"higher virtues" = better person... really?


Funny this is that the fair folk would agree with you. They have more virtues than humans... y'know.


See... more virtues just mean that they are more passionate, that they're more intense. Not that they're better.


EDIT - also, I should note that not all Deathlords would be... eager to convert via monstrance. Funny thing is that they're... rebellious or some such.

 

[Ryvaken Tadrya]

That assumes all the Solars agree on something. The same ego that makes them unfit to rule makes it just as unlikely for them to form such a coalition.

 

[cyl]

Except when unity serves their ego and gives them more power.

 

[Arthur]

That assumes all the Solars agree on something. The same ego that makes them unfit to rule makes it just as unlikely for them to form such a coalition.

Well, they did for a long time in the First Age.


Also, the mechanical effects of virtues do make the characters tend towards a generally good personality. Celestial and Terrestrial Exalts (not Fair Folk) with high Compassion will tend to help the suffering, those with high Conviction will remain faithful to their goals, those with high Temperance will stay away from exaggeration, and those with high Valour won't be cowardly or disloyal. That is enforced by the rules, that often make characters spend Willpower not to act in ways that go against their Virtues. Despite what the fluff says, the mechanics make these Virtues cause virtuous characters to be generally good --or less bad, at least-- than normal characters. And Exalts are virtuous.

 

[Ryvaken Tadrya]

Those with high Compassion won't do what needs to be done, those with high Conviction will sell out everyone and everything to achieve their goals, those with high Temperance will destroy all trappings of culture and luxury they can find, those with high Valor will rush into a fight on the flimsiest pretext.


High virtues are as bad as low ones.

 

[cyl]

I forgot one thing for the future... the Kukla :twisted:


It's said that should the Sun decide that civilization should be no more, he would free the Kukla and that he would be the destroyer of the lands, and give it a new life (the shadowland would not grow stronger with this "natural disaster").


Could be a good element in a tale, the world almost comes to an end, the dead and the demons invade Creation, as well as the Fair Folk, and the Kukla is awakened, destroys the invadors, and a new land is born. Few mortals and beastmen survived, mostly the ones living in the Threshold or in the bordermarches, many exalt die, and are reborn afterwards, rebuilding a new civilization.

 

[Arthur]

Pretty cool. I'd actually wait for the Locusts to come in and then do that, if I were the US.

 

[cyl]

Well I dunno if the US would want Auto dead... he might let the locust crusade be to let him regain consciousness and leave once more.


I know I wouldn't want Auto to become a Neverborn...


Also there is something about the Kukla I've read in RoGD which made me wonder how powerful the EDs are if one great elemental can destroy Creation and recreate it a new (with a few of his scales :shock: ).

 

[Jukashi]

How powerful are the Elemental Dragons? As in THE Elemental Dragons?


Pretty damn, I'd say.


The Kukla is made up of earth essence, but all earth essence in Creation is part of Pasiap. So if the Kukla is x powerful, where x is enough power to destroy Creation and then reclaim it from the Wyld, then Pasiap is about, oh... 10x powerful, at the very least.

 

[cyl]

Well I'm not sure of that one anymore, reading RoGD again, it seems the Kukla is slightly less powerful than Pasiap.


Considering Pasiap had to be put to bed by mommy to let humanity survive, the Kukla recieved a similar treatment by the Sun. It seems he's been powered up in 2e


Sidenote: we don't know if Pasiap's "keep" is guarded or not, but we do know that the Kukla's is, pretty damn well guarded actually.

 

[Jukashi]

Pasiap doesn't have a "keep". He is all the earth essence flowing through Creation.

 

[cyl]

Well I thought we had a previous disagreement on that one, but I think Pasiap is "just a god", responsible for the flow of Earth Essence, not the Earth essence nor the element Earth either, just as the god of, uh... paper, isn't paper itself.


But he does resides in the pole of Earth anyway.

 

[Feverfew]

What about the possibility of an Abyssal triumph that ends up ripping the Neverborn out of Creation without having everything hemorrhaging into the Abyss? ?_?


Granted I bring this up because I have an Abyssal who intends to DO this, but...

 

[Kyeudo]

What's holding the Neverborn in place is their Fetters, which happen to be the whole of Creation. If you can find a way to either cut all of them with some sort of epic Necromancy, you could probably destroy the Neverborn without destroying Creation.


The Underworld would probably crumble, though, as it only exists as an idealized version of Creation supported by the dreams of the Neverborn. That might leave a whole in the cycle of reincarnation that would connect directly to the Void. Abyssals would be free of Resonance, but lose all the fun Avatar charms and the benefits of their Whispers.

 

[cyl]

Yep that's one of the big holes in my "future past".


What do I do about the underworld and the deathknights ?


The progressive disappearance of the shadowlands is not a real problem, releasing the Kukla will likely destroy all the deathlords armies if not the deathlords themselves (and if they are destroyed, they're not likely getting out of the Labyrinth before some time) and leave nothing but rubble of shadowlands... in time solars will access the solar circle and fight off the shadowlands, or the vitality of the land created by the Kukla will slowly but surely absorb the death taint.


But since I want to get rid of the Great Curse, it means that the Neverborn have to be put back to sleep once more.


The Underworld will always exist, (there is nothing that can be done about that), but the dead will not poison the life of the living again. Trick question now is: what becomes of the abyssals ?


Their essences do not choose them as with the other celestials, it is the deathlord that chooses the candidates.


It may be that in the Kukla's wave of destruction the monstrances have been destroyed too, but in that case what would happen to them... Lytek hasn't the power to erase the death taint, and the Neverborn even appeased won't do a thing about it.

 

[Arthur]

Get a circle of Essence 9 Twilights and have them devise something to reverse the taint caused by the Monstrances. Shouldn't be that hard.

 

[Persell]

.....circle of Essence 9 Twilights.....Shouldn't be that hard.

*cough*

 

[cyl]

Yeah, not going to happen anytime soon.

 

[Kyeudo]

The progressive disappearance of the shadowlands is not a real problem, releasing the Kukla will likely destroy all the deathlords armies if not the deathlords themselves (and if they are destroyed, they're not likely getting out of the Labyrinth before some time) and leave nothing but rubble of shadowlands... in time solars will access the solar circle and fight off the shadowlands, or the vitality of the land created by the Kukla will slowly but surely absorb the death taint.

There is always the mortal way of getting rid of a shadowland. Would take a whole lot of salt, but you could get the job done eventually.

The Underworld will always exist, (there is nothing that can be done about that), but the dead will not poison the life of the living again. Trick question now is: what becomes of the abyssals ?


Their essences do not choose them as with the other celestials, it is the deathlord that chooses the candidates.

If an Abyssal Exaltation's Monstrance is destroyed, it goes roaming. No one can choose its target anymore, but it automatically seeks out a dying person who had an apropriately important destiny. They then instinctively know the terms of their Exaltation.

It may be that in the Kukla's wave of destruction the monstrances have been destroyed too, but in that case what would happen to them... Lytek hasn't the power to erase the death taint, and the Neverborn even appeased won't do a thing about it.

Corrupting a Solar Essence to an Abyssal is a Void Circle Necromancy, so the inverse should be true. Redeeming an Abyssal back into a Solar would then be a Solar Circle Sorcery.

 

[cyl]

There is always the mortal way of getting rid of a shadowland. Would take a whole lot of salt, but you could get the job done eventually.

Good luck with the Bayou of Eternal Regret :lol:

Corrupting a Solar Essence to an Abyssal is a Void Circle Necromancy, so the inverse should be true. Redeeming an Abyssal back into a Solar would then be a Solar Circle Sorcery.

Well things have changed from 1e to 2e.
In 1e the exaltation wasn't complete until the Deathknight had been presented before the Neverborn. Which is why the abyssal made by the Princess was going insane.


Redeeming an abyssal was possible with a complex ritual involving a volontary abyssal, a Zenith priest to catch the favor of the Sun, a Solar Circle Sorcerer, and the favor of the stars allowing the abyssal to reintegrate the Loom.


In 2e apparently it has been changed, and the black exaltation is complete once you sign with the DL, so I guess you're right, a Solar Circle Sorcerer could do the trick... much less epic though.

 

[Arthur]

Ok, make it Essence 7. You can have those in had a dozen centuries.

 

[cyl]

Well considering the solar circle spell thing, you just need essence 5 :roll:

 

[cyl]

But I think I'm going to keep the abyssal as "freaks" in the future setting. They are cool anti hero.


And I can use the whole "mutant problem" complex as a theme.


And they have an affinity with the underworld, death and ghosts, which is pretty rare in a world where deathlords are gone and Neverborn asleep.


However, Resonance would still work.