Viewpoint Unpopular roleplay opinions?

[Mollberg]

I think not allowing auto-hitting in combat roleplays is dumb.

I get why people don't allow it, but it creates more problems than it solves (mostly because it doesn't solve any problems to begin with).

 

[SP3CT3R]

I think not allowing auto-hitting in combat roleplays is dumb.

I get why people don't allow it, but it creates more problems than it solves (mostly because it doesn't solve any problems to begin with).

Auto-hitting takes away player agency because it lets whoever's playing the attacking character decide how the character they attack responds.

And there are lots of inexperienced roleplayers probably won't allow their attacks to miss if they get to choose.

 

[Mollberg]

Auto-hitting takes away player agency because it lets whoever's playing the attacking character decide how the character they attack responds.

Don't really see the issue with that tbh. Given that you don't let every attack auto-hit, naturally.

And there are lots of inexperienced roleplayers probably won't allow their attacks to miss if they get to choose.

And the same people probably won't let their character get hit either if they get to choose.

 

[SP3CT3R]

Don't really see the issue with that tbh. Given that you don't let every attack auto-hit, naturally.

It's not just a matter of hit or miss. There's a lot that can be said in how a someone reacts to being attacked in different ways, and a player might want a chance to flesh their character out in doing so.

And the same people probably won't let their character get hit either if they get to choose

Okay, you got me there.

 

[Melpomene]

I think the message RPers peddle that RPing is a good way to learn to write or improve their writing and thus others should use it for that too is wrong. If you personally want to use it for that fine, but don't peddle that message to the public like it's fact or get so butthurt when people aren't good enough.

I never started RPing to learn to write, I never used it as a skill developing tool and in fact RPing has taught me some of the worst writing skills I have that I had to unlearn to write prose. Roleplay is a game that uses prose as part of it's tool kit, but you don't need to be a novelist to play, like with TTRPGs storytelling is part of the tool kit but you don't need to be good at it (or use it much at all) to make it fun. So stop telling Para-RPers that RPing is a good way to develop skills to write a book and putting pressure on people to get better at writing just so you aren't hindered in your writer improvement journey.

Like fuck off go take a Creative Writing 101 Class at your local collage and stop using peoples hobby and game as your writers self improvement tool and getting mad when others aren't bending over backwards to write fully fleshed out 3 dimensional dynamic characters, grand sweeping prose without any error, planning every scene like anyone but us is going to be reading this shit. God damn it I just want to RP my shitty little plot with it's shitty little romance about two shitty people and their shitty friends and some nebulous enemy we eventually get to maybe but not before we do some stupid circling melodrama for the vast majority of the damn game.

Lmao anyone who goes around claiming roleplaying can teach you a lot about writing are damn liars. Maaaaybe it can help improve prose and flesh out characters? But that's it. I hate it when people treat it like a job, it's a hobby, I come here to have fun. Why can't peeps just let people have fun

 

[FoolsErin]

I think the message RPers peddle that RPing is a good way to learn to write or improve their writing and thus others should use it for that too is wrong. If you personally want to use it for that fine, but don't peddle that message to the public like it's fact or get so butthurt when people aren't good enough.

I never started RPing to learn to write, I never used it as a skill developing tool and in fact RPing has taught me some of the worst writing skills I have that I had to unlearn to write prose. Roleplay is a game that uses prose as part of it's tool kit, but you don't need to be a novelist to play, like with TTRPGs storytelling is part of the tool kit but you don't need to be good at it (or use it much at all) to make it fun. So stop telling Para-RPers that RPing is a good way to develop skills to write a book and putting pressure on people to get better at writing just so you aren't hindered in your writer improvement journey.

Like fuck off go take a Creative Writing 101 Class at your local collage and stop using peoples hobby and game as your writers self improvement tool and getting mad when others aren't bending over backwards to write fully fleshed out 3 dimensional dynamic characters, grand sweeping prose without any error, planning every scene like anyone but us is going to be reading this shit. God damn it I just want to RP my shitty little plot with it's shitty little romance about two shitty people and their shitty friends and some nebulous enemy we eventually get to maybe but not before we do some stupid circling melodrama for the vast majority of the damn game.

Preach it. I admit when I started "seriously" roleplaying when I was 12 did definitely get me into writing outside of school and has definitely encouraged me to learn how to string a sentence together, but I know it's not that for everyone. To act like it always should be some great form of art is some outright pretentious bullshit. Roleplaying is fun. You don't always have to have deep complex reasons for having fun.

 

[peritwinkle]

As a novella writer, I don’t mind shorter replies during intense/dialogue scenes that require a lot of back and forth between characters. I would rather they give me something good to work with and cut unnecessary filler.

 

[Andei]

To push back just a little on some of the expressed views that RPing shouldn't be a pedagogical tool for learning how to write creatively and that to aspire to a 'higher art form' with this particular writing medium, I have a couple of points - but that said, I totally agree that people who use the above reasons as a justification to pressurise and put down other writers are horribly misled.

Anyway, here are just a couple of personal opinions:

1 | Literary skills aside, it's a helpful way to practice writing regularly. I've found it a great way to practice writing constantly, because you have to come up with ideas week by week while having a partner or partners to bounce them off. After all, even with irl stuff to be busy about, you do feel bad if you've left someone hanging for a while, and it does serve as a motivation to at least write something on a regular basis, which I think is a very useful skill for a writer. In terms of whether it actually improves your literary abilities, I think that's more subjective, and I'd say it works better for some people than others.​

​

2 | Aspiring to a high standard of writing can be fun in a different way from writing more 'casually'. When I say 'casually', I mean it in the sense that it is of little consequence as to whether your writing is good or bad in a literary sense - as long as it serves the purpose of enabling your participation in the game. Also, I don't want anyone to misunderstand - quality of writing does not equate to quality of fun. However, I think it would be rash to say quality of writing has no impact on how you enjoy the RP experience. While I think imposing your standards on others is unhelpful (especially when you become irritated when those standards aren't met), aspiring to a higher standard of writing in RPs has led to some of the most fulfilling examples of collective storytelling I've experienced.​

​

I kind of think of RPing as going to karaoke - it would be a bit silly to go and expect a industry-level concert experience and it's really just a chance to let loose with some random tunes with some random friends. But sometimes I go with a bunch of singer friends (once upon a time, before the whole pandemic thing eh) and it's genuinely awesome because they're killing all the high notes and nailing all the runs and it's so much fun! Similarly, when I see my RP partners giving amazing descriptions, subtle emotional changes and wonderful character developments, I feel pumped to respond in kind. I've had other writers bring out parts of my characters even I didn't know were there, like they found something I didn't see and wove it into their response with great sensitivity.​

Again, I'm in no way endorsing any kind of dismissive, pressuring or discourteous attitude on account of one's beliefs that RPing presents an opportunity to grow as a writer and / or aspire to high standard of writing. I just wanted to agree with everyone here who said roleplaying is supposed to be fun, while also putting in two cents about how you can have fun with both complex and non-complex RP mindsets alike, regardless of whether you are a 'part-time' RPer or a 'full-time' RPer, a plot-scribbling fanboy or a writer-hopeful!

 

[Doomevil]

Yeah I think you nailed it right there. I've met people who like Rping because it's fun and met people who do want to improve on their craft. I think they're both valid reasons wanting to enjoy the hobby. However, I do have opinions of my own about that.

There's this group I've collaborated with for years now, and I've watched them improve and I saw a huge difference between now and then where their posts became much more detailed and long. I'm happy that everyone found their talents in that group, but at the same time, I miss that casual atmosphere back when we began, where we were just dipping our toes and found something in common. Most likely part of that is because of nostalgia. Yet, whenever I make a post nowadays, I spend more time thinking about how to plan this writing out and wonder if it'll be reacted well to others. Sometimes I get this bad habit of padding out the post just to make it as long as the others. I feel like I have to keep up with the rest or it's seen as sidelining material. It's a mixed feeling, but I do agree people wouldn't act snobby to others getting into the hobby. Because we were new once, let them enjoy it while it lasts.

But yeah, sometimes I do wish to go back where my writing was simple and wasn't as detailed. Otherwise it feels like writing a novel, and that just feels a bit prestigious.

 

[Andei]

AnnJam I apologise for my lack of clarity, but I'm not sure where the point was missed - I don't think that anywhere in my post I've ever advocated pressuring people to turn RP into a reason for improving your writing, and indeed I believe I've stated that I think this is highly problematic. I've also stated a number of times that RP is for fun, and have outright said that I agree with what everyone has said (including yourself) that roleplaying is supposed to be fun. That has always been its primary purpose, and improving your writing is secondary, if that.

I don't believe I was even contradicting your point about imposing 'RPing = improved writing quality' as fact on other writers, and I for one don't think RPing necessarily improves your literary skills:

In terms of whether it actually improves your literary abilities, I think that's more subjective, and I'd say it works better for some people than others.

The fact that you are usually expected to write on some kind of regular basis, however, is I think generally regarded as true across the community, and it's my opinion that the ability to write consistently and stay motivated are useful skills for a writer-hopeful - this is my personal opinion however, but I feel that within the remit of this thread called 'Unpopular roleplay opinions' I hope I'm allowed to express it, with the disclaimer that again, I do not advocate using it as the basis for imposing higher standards of writing on other writers with pressuring behaviour.

The primary point I was trying to get across was that there is no universal measure by which quality of writing equates to quality of fun, and that it is possible for roleplaying to be fun across the whole spectrum of writing skill and aspiration, as evidenced by the many threads which exist and have existed with a number of writers of wildly varying writing ability. In short, roleplaying can be and should be fun for everyone regardless of the level of writing ability they aspire to and if I'm not being too presumptuous, I believe this is also your stance (please do correct me if I am wrong). Of course, if the pressure to write well-crafted posts leads to writers becoming anxious and burning out then that would be terrible - it goes against the whole point of having fun roleplaying. And once again, to pressure others to do so is unacceptable. My post was intended to offer an additional (not contradicting) perspective that in some cases, the motivation to write at a higher standard is a way of having fun roleplaying, which is not, in my view, at odds with yours.

The only point I might possibly disagree with you on is the following:

What does my ability have to do with you learning to improve your own writing, you should be able to practice what you've self taught yourself as you write your reply to me regardless of whether or not I typo'd!

I think that there is a connection between a partner's ability and the improvement of one's own writing. In my experience, replying to a highly well-crafted post often motivates me to match in quality, and I just find their skill as a writer so admirable and I'm motivated to emulate them. Conversely (and this is purely my personal opinion), replying to poorly-phrased one-liners can be more difficult, but this can be either a welcome challenge or a de-motivating hurdle, especially for a writer who wants to improve through RP (but that's kind of their problem, not their partner's).

So a partner's ability does influence one's learning to improve their own writing, but I agree (as previously stated) that this is not a valid reason for one writer to pressure another for the sake of that improvement. If you were not contesting that there is a link between one writer's ability and the improvement of another's, then I apologise in advance for not grasping your intent.

Hope that clears up any misconceptions!

 

[Gowi]

I think not allowing auto-hitting in combat roleplays is dumb.

I get why people don't allow it, but it creates more problems than it solves (mostly because it doesn't solve any problems to begin with).

Autohitting is fine in the hands of reliable players you trust. Just hard to make that distinction when you're dealing with randoms who may or may not be into powergaming.

 

[cirrostratus]

I personally think that players shouldn't need to know the sexuality or preferences of each other's OCs.

It ruins the fun and uncertainty when everyone knows he'll say yes because he's gay and is totally into blue-haired tall guys.

I want my OC to be allowed to flirt and tease with uncertainty -- even if he locked onto someone he wanted. I also want to be allowed to let him say "no" because he's not attracted to their appearance [he prioritises looks > personality].

I'm saying this because I think RP romance and shipping have become too [ughh idk words help gimme an adj], where as soon as my OC flirts then that means I want to ship him when it might just be his personality. Likewise, I want to let him say "no" while knowing that his response wouldn't mean that he definitely won't get shipped with them [or another person of the same gender] later.

Just because my OC says "No" to a woman, doesn't mean I want him with a man.

 

[Jannah]

I personally think that players shouldn't need to know the sexuality or preferences of each other's OCs.

It ruins the fun and uncertainty when everyone knows he'll say yes because he's gay and is totally into blue-haired tall guys.

I want my OC to be allowed to flirt and tease with uncertainty -- even if he locked onto someone he wanted. I also want to be allowed to let him say "no" because he's not attracted to their appearance [he prioritises looks > personality].

I'm saying this because I think RP romance and shipping have become too [ughh idk words help gimme an adj], where as soon as my OC flirts then that means I want to ship him when it might just be his personality. Likewise, I want to let him say "no" while knowing that his response wouldn't mean that he definitely won't get shipped with them [or another person of the same gender] later.

Just because my OC says "No" to a woman, doesn't mean I want him with a man.

I think mostly the sexuality of characters is established since some people may only be comfortable with certain types of pairings. I, for example, don't play MxM romance anymore due to bad experiences (any other pairings are fair game, though). That is something that is important for people to know upfront.

 

[cirrostratus]

I think mostly the sexuality of characters is established since some people may only be comfortable with certain types of pairings. I, for example, don't play MxM romance anymore due to bad experiences (any other pairings are fair game, though). That is something that is important for people to know upfront.

Ahhh, okay. Thank you for explaining that.

What about group roleplays? As in, when people are in groups and people often organise ships or say "does anyone want to be shipped with my bi OC" when [to me] it could have been more interesting if they didn't do that, but just made their OC reject people and then the play explain why?

I hope I don't sound ignorant.

 

[CecilDMMasters]

I'm saying this because I think RP romance and shipping have become too [ughh idk words help gimme an adj], where as soon as my OC flirts then that means I want to ship him when it might just be his personality.

Undeveloped. Lacking feeling. Needlessly mandatory. Forced. Uncomfortable.

I don't do romance, but have run into ship zombies that see romance at the drop of a hat. The reasons they give to ship are so cliched or arbitrary. I hope they never get a career as a marriage councilor.

 

[nerdy tangents]

Ahhh, okay. Thank you for explaining that.

What about group roleplays? As in, when people are in groups and people often organise ships or say "does anyone want to be shipped with my bi OC" when [to me] it could have been more interesting if they didn't do that, but just made their OC reject people and then the play explain why?

I hope I don't sound ignorant.

So groups rarely have anything to do with shipping (from the plot perspective) so usually what happens is people want pre-established relationships.

Assuming this is a situation where everyone isn’t meeting each other for the first time in the first post. Then plotting out relationships (platonic AND romantic) makes a lot of sense.

Also romance role players tend to heavily identify with their characters. So just in the same way they want to avoid rejection in real life they want to avoid it in roleplays.

Lastly as awful as it is to say some people are just homophobic. They are not comfortable with certain sexualities so they want to know which characters to avoid entirely.

 

[cirrostratus]

So groups rarely have anything to do with shipping (from the plot perspective) so usually what happens is people want pre-established relationships.

Assuming this is a situation where everyone isn’t meeting each other for the first time in the first post. Then plotting out relationships (platonic AND romantic) makes a lot of sense.

Also romance role players tend to heavily identify with their characters. So just in the same way they want to avoid rejection in real life they want to avoid it in roleplays.

Lastly as awful as it is to say some people are just homophobic. They are not comfortable with certain sexualities so they want to know which characters to avoid entirely.

Ahh okay thank you.

I'd read some posts from a few group rps before and seen people doing romance things. I probably should have guessed they could have been pre-established

 

[Jannah]

Lastly as awful as it is to say some people are just homophobic. They are not comfortable with certain sexualities so they want to know which characters to avoid entirely.

I doubt it's what you were implying, but just because a person is not comfortable playing out FxF or MxM pairings it doesn't necessarily mean they're homophobic.

 

[nerdy tangents]

I doubt it's what you were implying, but just because a person is not comfortable playing out FxF or MxM pairings it doesn't necessarily mean they're homophobic.

I know I mean there are literally people who avoid any character who is not heterosexual because they are homophobic.

I have run into them in the past. Where non-heterosexual characters existing at all is cause for endless drama. Because apparently even fictional queer people bring the wrath of the devil on us all.

 

[Jannah]

I know I mean there are literally people who avoid any character who is not heterosexual because they are homophobic.

I have run into them in the past. Where non-heterosexual characters existing at all is cause for endless drama. Because apparently even fictional queer people bring the wrath of the devil on us all.

Yea, it definitely depends on why the people do not want to do the queer pairings. Like, I personally will do any pairing except for MxM now. Not because I hate gay men, but because of bad experiences with that particular pairing in the past. In other cases a person is just not comfortable in their ability to represent gay couples accurately. That's something I've seen a lot.

 

[nerdy tangents]

Yea, it definitely depends on why the people do not want to do the queer pairings. Like, I personally will do any pairing except for MxM now. Not because I hate gay men, but because of bad experiences with that particular pairing in the past. In other cases a person is just not comfortable in their ability to represent gay couples accurately. That's something I've seen a lot.

Sure but typically speaking those people don’t care about sexuality in a group. Because with a group you don’t have to ship every character so it doesn’t matter if my character is gay/bi/asexual/etc. heck it doesn’t matter if my characters sexuality isn’t listed at all.

That was the point I was making. In a GROUP typically the only reason someone wants to know sexuality is

1. They want to pre-establish relationships with all characters (platonic and romantic)
2. They want to avoid characters they find objectionable

Typically speaking actual pairing searches happen in 1x1 not groups.

 

[CecilDMMasters]

Also romance role players tend to heavily identify with their characters. So just in the same way they want to avoid rejection in real life they want to avoid it in roleplays.

I certainly can't speak for all romance roleplayers as I'm sure many are good RPers. But as I'm not into romance and don't hide it the ones I've dealt with who don't take no for an answer I noticed are quite emotional and easily upset when their ships don't go as they thought. Very much a toxic self insert moment. Or an equally overly insulted moment at their idea being rejected attitude.

Lastly as awful as it is to say some people are just homophobic. They are not comfortable with certain sexualities so they want to know which characters to avoid entirely.

Well, I have a few online friends that are homosexuals. In fact my best online friend is in a same sex marriage. And two people I work with regularly are lesbian. And for the record on my experience talking to actual homosexuals vs RP, I didn't know they were homosexual until I got to know them. It is not their main personality. It just kind of was revealed in the getting to know each other process naturally.

I admit I avoid RPs with characters advertised as homosexual because I've had too many RPs fail because the person's character being homosexual was the only real trait of the character. And often the main focus of the plot for them. If I was RPing with someone who had a character that was gay and didn't advertise and it came out normally I would not stop the RP. But well, as some basically explained above toxic RPers can make simple things a red flag.

In my case it was either they fell in the group of feeling real life knocked them down and RP was their way to cope. They seemed to project a urge for everything to be overly nice among the mains and all bad guy negativity was all because the character was gay (even if that had nothing to do with it). Or the the RP hit a sudden social justice warrior note out the gate. So the conflict was over how people unjustly judged gay people. And they just looked for a reason for the character (and themselves OOC) to shove in the conflict and issues.


Also, a note on the toxic hypocrisy of people who want to complain of being disrespected. I have had both ship zombies and a SJW character try to tell me asexuality was not real. Seriously?

 

[nerdy tangents]

CecilDMMasters we have definitely had very different experiences both real life and in roleplays. Outside family members (which our family has some toxic ass people) everyone I have met who was LGBTQ absolutely mentioned it. And most of the LGBTQ characters I played with where just people who happened to be LGBTQ.

I think it helps that I don’t do romantic role plays as a general rule so it makes it easier to write relationships authentically. I have noticed that in general romance role players tend to be bad about writing relationships.

Not all of them but a vast majority can’t write character relationships at all (regardless of sexuality).

That said I have definitely run into homophobes who are like asexuality doesn’t exist, means your broken, or is a plot from the devil because it means your gay.

like that last one the person was downright unhinged when it came to people being anything other than straight. Yelled at me for a good ten minutes about their “religion”.

Others pulled the I am not homophobic I just can’t write a fictional universe where LGBTQ people exist. I am so tempted to ask those people “So if I said I wasn’t racist but then forbid you to make white characters? Would that still be okay because white people make me “uncomfortable?” (They don’t but sometimes I feel like getting petty with people.)

 

[CecilDMMasters]

CecilDMMasters we have definitely had very different experiences both real life and in roleplays. Outside family members (which our family has some toxic ass people) everyone I have met who was LGBTQ absolutely mentioned it. And most of the LGBTQ characters I played with where just people who happened to be LGBTQ.

I think it helps that I don’t do romantic role plays as a general rule so it makes it easier to write relationships authentically. I have noticed that in general romance role players tend to be bad about writing relationships.

Not all of them but a vast majority can’t write character relationships at all (regardless of sexuality).

That said I have definitely run into homophobes who are like asexuality doesn’t exist, means your broken, or is a plot from the devil because it means your gay.

like that last one the person was downright unhinged when it came to people being anything other than straight. Yelled at me for a good ten minutes about their “religion”.

Others pulled the I am not homophobic I just can’t write a fictional universe where LGBTQ people exist. I am so tempted to ask those people “So if I said I wasn’t racist but then forbid you to make white characters? Would that still be okay because white people make me “uncomfortable?” (They don’t but sometimes I feel like getting petty with people.)

I don't look for romance, but doesn't stop someone trying to get in the pants of my character and get angry I make it clear they are asexual aromantic. Does no one ever check a RP search and think the rules extend into the whole RP!

It is amazing how a lifestyle of not wanting a romantic relationship is so threatening to people. And the worst is people don't believe you can be bullied for it. But the fact I never want to marry and have kids is the weirdest thing about me somehow.

For me most friend's and acquaintance's relationship concepts didn't come up until talking about non work things was a thing. Then it was just a matter of who the heck cares if this woman is saying wife instead of husband. Most people in fact are not prone to throw out their marital status in the first few meetings actually. Granted I'm not into non work or online social groups that aren't aimed at hobby or pets instead of just making friends. Unless someone is just a huge talker bout everything I will usually know about animals and hobbies well before any actual personal info. (kids on the other hand people will tell you about them at the drop of a hat. It's like cat people on a pet page but with human children. A random customer at work literally made her mom show me a pic of her kids in their Halloween costume once. I was just prepping a fabric order for them. The costumes were adorable.)

I got a way to deal with the difficult people who don't agree me. Make a rule to just not talk about what you don't agree on. One person is religious one is a evolutionist. Skip those topics. One person is a vegan and one a near carnivore skip food conversation. One is a cat person and one is a dog person. If someone is uncomfortable with something then don't talk about it. And if it's a life choice and you don't like hearing them talk to people in the break room as a eaves dropper then well, the world as all kinds grow up and get over it. No point in history has everyone agreed with everyone else. Also the option to stop talking to them all together exist. Easier online than IRL I admit. Works great. Unless they are that one family member angry I work(and get along with) lesbians and the only friends from my past I talk two are a mixed marriage couple. Then well, family is harder to cut out. Dang it.

Now back to the topic of RP. As far as someone not comfortable with things in RP. That comes down in the end to not being compatible and move on. Right or wrong, good or bad, meeting rules of the church they worship or flat being racist and hateful. Doesn't matter no one should jump on their page and preach at them or go nuts on them. Main reason for RP rules and pre discussion before hand. It's a game and even if one wants to SJW someone's preference or attack someone's ideas the end is people can RP things you disagree with (as long as they aren't forcing it on you). I personally find a lot of fetish to be pretty bad but if someone is honest in their search and doesn't try to force it on people not into then well, what a grown person does on the privacy of his Deviantart notes with his partner isn't bothering me at the end of the day. If I find seeing the ads all the time queasy then I use site tools like block to stop seeing them. Not like I was talking to them anyway and they will notice the block.

Don't let an unhinged person destroy your whole day.

Now if I can get that cat hating, over political, racist family member to shut up when over for dinner.

 

[nerdy tangents]

Oh the role plays don’t last. As soon as you pull the I’m not a bigot I just don’t believe an entire groups of people should exist argument it’s a polite “Well I don’t think we fit have a good day.”

Some don’t take no for an answer but they would be dicks anyway just because how dare you tell them no.

As for real life I really think it’s a cultural thing. People do bring up relationships at the drop of the hat here, I think as a way of normalizing it. I mean honestly as aro/ace yeah I get it. I don’t give a fuck what relationships anyone is in. But it is culturally expected for people to talk about who their dating, who their married to, their kids, etc. So you learn about someone’s same sex relationship in the same way you hear about someone’s heterosexual relationship. Because it’s expected that you share that as a point of conversation.

(honestly where you live sounds way better ngl, but I guess we are all a productive of our environments)