The new Mask of Winters is...

Never said they didn't... Looking through their art though, there has been a lot less stuff that made me get shivers down my spine than the stuff from WW.
 
WW takes more chances.  WotC goes for a stable market, and are much more conservative in their marketing.  


The pioneers are the fellas with the arrows in their backs.


WW has been taking arrows for a while now.  Changleling?  Not a bad idea, but the systems were just frippin' awful.  A really neat idea, but not so much that you could ever really combine the systems, and the cards idea was even worse--WW trying to leap onto a bandwagon that was already comign to a halt.  


Art wise, WW has usually had better artists, but their format was just not great for the art they were putting up.  Now, they're willing to go toe to toe production value-wise with WotC, and I hope that folks see the potential for great play in the WW system--heck, I converted my Cyberpunk game to d10 back in the day, and I've got half a dozen other games ported into it.  One of the reasons that the Modernis stuff came together to easy that most of the work was already done.


If I post up my Atlantian Exalted setting, it's only going to take a few weeks of editing to pull together the mechanics, and another few weeks to pull together the source material.  


Of course, the 3rd Age Exalted setting I'm thinking about is mostly based on the Atlantean setting that I worked up for Adventure so it's mostly done already.  The question is getting Modernis tooled up for 2E and then converting it back to the Atlantis bits.


Dragon Blooded Quistarches...so delicious.  No Vampires either.  No Garou.  No Magi.  Just Exalts and Thaumaturges, Oh My.
 
You want I should keep it to myself, to save wear and tear, I can do that...


But you won't see the 8' Quistarche armor for tiny little Dragon Blood Sorcerers...


Seriously.  Part of the setting has the Quistarches being limited to under 5' tall, because the Iron that was laid down can only accomodate someone of tiny stature inside the shell in the chest.  Think of the Quistarche armor as a small Warstrider that carries a 10' kwando lance, and you're beginning to see why the Quistarches in that setting are going to be bad ass--sort of an cross between a Magistrate and the Inquisition rolled into one.  All warrior-sorcerers, dedicated to beating down the Infernal and keeping it far from the regular folks.  And acting as secret police for the Hierarchy that rules Europe...


Yes, there will be a Europe.  And a Zhonggou.  And Nihonjin kitsune style ninjas.  And a Great Zimbabwe. And a strong Songhai.  And the People of the Book will be pretty much contained in the Caliphates.  And there will be Aztlani Jaguar Knights carrying flechette rifles, decked out in black coat and mirrorplate.  And the Fifteen Nations and Algonkwa will be seperate entities.  And their heroes, the Exalted will be rare commodities, still Cursed.  And once again, the Solars will march forth from their Jade Prison to survey what hath been wrought in their long absence...
 
Stillborn said:
I still don't unserstand what's "incompatible".
-S
Click to expand...
As in,"The crunchy bits from the old books no longer work with the crunchy bits from the new books." As in;


incompatible:ADJECTIVE: 1. Incapable of associating or blending or of being associated or blended because of disharmony, incongruity, or antagonism: incompatible views on religion. 2. Impossible to be held simultaneously by one person: the incompatible offices of prosecutor and judge. 3. Logic That cannot be simultaneously true; mutually exclusive. 4. Medicine a. Producing an undesirable effect when used in combination with a particular substance: a medication that is incompatible with alcohol. b. Not immunologically compatible: incompatible blood types. Source


Specifically the first part. They don't work together now. Even Cult of the Illuminated which being so new should be, isn't.


And while lots of people either don't remember or choose to ignore it, GCG said in a couple of developer chats that if Exalted was ever given a revision, it would only be the core, and only to clean up the Solar charms to the level of quality of later books, and maybe in intergrate some of power combat.


However, as usually happens in White Wolf, new developer comes in and just had to swing around his creative dick, and make the game "his". It happened with WoD, with the Aeonverse, and I'm sure it will happen eventually wit the nWoD. I had hope that it would not happen with Exalted, and I'd not end up having an extensive collection of useless. Which, if I want to stay current (often required for those of us in convention circuts), means I have $400 of useless on my shelf. Does that make it clear to you?
 
operations said:
As in,"The crunchy bits from the old books no longer work with the crunchy bits from the new books." As in;
Click to expand...
Not directly. But in that sense Power Combat from the PG is "incompatible" with 1st Edition.


The two editions are SO easy to convert back and forth, however, that there's really nothing reasonable to complain about?


Have you looked into the 2nd Edition system to see how it works, and find it insufficently compatible, or are you just assuming?


-S
 
Have you looked into the 2nd Edition system to see how it works, and find it insufficently compatible, or are you just assuming?
Click to expand...
I've looked into it. The Demo had enough of the rules to get a fair idea of how it works. I like a few things, like I said (the Anima automatic at 11+ motes, for example) and will probaly house rule those in to our 1st edition game.


It also really does me no good to blow money on it even if I wanted to. My game is a mixed game, 2 Solars, a Lunar, a Sidereal, and a Terrestrial, and it's not worth switching over till all the books are out.


And as I said, I really, really, hate the tick system for init. It just bugs me. And I've tried it, a couple times. Even with the tick sheets you made. Still hate it.
 
Sorry to say that, but you sound like someone who does not want to spend the money and is looking for excuses to justify that to himself and the people around him. You don't have to do that, nobody cares, but please, no more rants, they are getting so old so fast and bringing them up in every thread you post doesn't make it any better.
 
No, the problem is, I loved 1E, and wanted to love 2E, and wanted to buy it. But the more I look into it, the more it doesn't feel like the same game to me.


Less epic heroics, more anime I guess is the best way to put it.
 
Having picked it up, and am currently reading through it, I think that your fears are unfounded.  


Borrow a book and give it a perusal--a real one, not just the demo, which was 2E's weak and dyspepsic sister.  It's got a lot of good material, clearer material, and the rules sets are just presented better this time around--and a lot of the information that was distributed throughout several supplements is in the BWB this time around.  


I too feared the new edition, but it's just clearer about several things.  In the sense that there is less flavor text, and more honest rules, it is different.  Less ambiguity--and I for one welcome that.
 
After all ops, you can add house rules to 2e as well.  It seems you may have a bit of them for your 1e, so technically your game is not 1e compatible now.   :P


Having said that, I have not played it yet, but I am reading through the book and it presents things in a more organized system.  


But you do have a point about the mixed game.  You can't run a 2e game at the moment with Lunars.  As an occasional npc, perhaps, but not as a player.  That's why this weekend we are going to blowup the Games of Divinity.  :twisted:


Good thing the Deathlords did not get these weapons, who knows what they would have done.  :shock:
 
uteck said:
You can't run a 2e game at the moment with Lunars.
Click to expand...
Sure you can. Converting the Charm mechanics is trivial. The eventual Lunars 2.0 book may have totally different Charm trees, but so what?


-S
 
Having picked it up, and am currently reading through it, I think that your fears are unfounded.  
Borrow a book and give it a perusal--a real one, not just the demo, which was 2E's weak and dyspepsic sister.  
Click to expand...
Isn't a store for miles and miles up here that carry Exalted these days.   I got into it when I still lived in the capital area MI rather than the great redneck north. While I love it up here, and my kids are safer, and I'm a lot less jumpy and stressed, it is part of the MI bible belt, and we're lucky to have a game store with Warhammer 40K and D&D. I'm not going to order a book I can't look at first.
 
Hey OPERATIONS,


"""incompatible:ADJECTIVE: ......."""


++Giving us a Dictionary definition is not answering the question. In this case, it comes off like a 5 yr old with a "cut 'n paste tool" rant. I know that's not what you were trying to do, but that is how it seems. It ticks off the listening audience when treats them like children below and beyond expected reason. Don't do that.


Specifically the first part. They don't work together now. Even Cult of the Illuminated which being so new should be, isn't.


++What in the first part is really that incompatible with 1e? The first part of the 2e book is the developers notes and credits. Give us conflicting quotes from the books that we can match side by side. This will establish a much more compelling argument and win the audience to your side. Write like an Eclipse, not like a Fire Caste. Leave passion at the door.


And while lots of people either don't remember or choose to ignore it, GCG said in a couple of developer chats that if Exalted was ever given a revision, it would only be the core, and only to clean up the Solar charms to the level of quality of later books, and maybe in intergrate some of power combat.


++Where or when did they say this? Can you show us where?


"However, as usually happens in White Wolf, new developer comes in and just had to swing around his creative dick, and make the game "his". It happened with WoD, with the Aeonverse, and I'm sure it will happen eventually wit the nWoD. I had hope that it would not happen with Exalted, and I'd not end up having an extensive collection of useless. Which, if I want to stay current (often required for those of us in convention circuts), means I have $400 of useless on my shelf. Does that make it clear to you?"


++Other than some name-calling(Cheap Shots), complaints of money(outside topic), and vague generalizations involving repetition(outside topic), there is nothing in this discussion that covers or discusses "incompatibility" in any part.


++Finally your greatest complaint is that you have not looked at the book.


"...we're lucky to have a game store with Warhammer 40K and D&D. I'm not going to order a book I can't look at first."


++You are arguing that you hate a book you have not seen. This is like saying I do not like the tie and miniskirt you are not wearing and trying to be serious at the same time.


How can one argue a point that has no foundation?


As the rich dude in My Fair Lady said...


Don't talk of Love lasting for hours,


No hearts and Flowers!


SHOW ME!!!


Show me the incompatibility.


Show me the mistakes.


Show me the disrespect for castes.


Show me the babsis for the argument.


Be the Eclipse!
 
This topic had been dead and closed for 6 days, and you come back with that. Now who's trolling?
 
archaratar said:
And while lots of people either don't remember or choose to ignore it, GCG said in a couple of developer chats that if Exalted was ever given a revision, it would only be the core, and only to clean up the Solar charms to the level of quality of later books, and maybe in intergrate some of power combat.


++Where or when did they say this? Can you show us where?
Click to expand...
And to answer that, if another C&P and link won't be too immature for you:


http://www.white-wolf.com/exalted/index ... icleid=202


And to quote->

rules_law_student (May 5, 2005 9:54:10 PM)


Will Exalted be revised, and what do anticipate will be the extent of Exalted Revised?


geoffrey c grabowski (May 5, 2005 9:56:00 PM)


It will be revised some day, that is for sure. I anticipate the extent will be moderate. Nothing formal about the rules will be changed, but there might be significant revisions to the elements of that structure. There will be Trees and Charms and most of them will have the same names and relationships.


geoffrey c grabowski (May 5, 2005 9:56:24 PM)


But the mechanics and specifics will be up for flux.


geoffrey c grabowski (May 5, 2005 9:56:58 PM)


Likewise, many elements of the combat system will probably be retained, like the order of modifier operations, but various specific steps of the combat event may see alteration.


geoffrey c grabowski (May 5, 2005 9:57:42 PM)


In terms of timeframe, I would anticipate it will be someday. Not incredibly soon, not when you are a little old gamer in a wheelchair.
Click to expand...
So, yeah, we expected changes. Some stuff to streamline charms, combat, etc. Not a complete replacement of a 30+ book libray of games. Two abilities are gone, replaced with two new ones. No prior weapons will use the same stats, with the changes in combat. No, fluff is not invalidated, but almost nothing with stats can't be used without house rules now.  We also expected a bit of time, not less than a year after the Autobot book.


However, they way you hit on this 6 days after the rest of us had dropped it, the way you called me out, in CAPS, and made run on quote blocks, and that last bit about "Be the ECLIPSE!", I deduct that you are a drooling fanboy, not interested in debate, and maybe coming after me (with your low number of posts) from the White Wolf forums.


Stillborn and I were disagreeing over what compatable meant. I posted a definition for common grounds. Then I went to explain. Some people have differing ideas on what backwards compatible means. To me, the PS2 to PS1 is backwards compatible. I can use my PS1 games in my PS2 with little effort or alteration. With the new exalted, I can not use my 1E books in my 2E game without work and alteration.
 
Wow.


That's just... wow. Someone has a lot of time on thier hands. And sounds emo to me.
 
What's so horrible about necroposting? :(


Seriously, I never understood why people over the Internet would rather create several duplicate threads than sticking to one true thread. What's so bad about it? If the new post brings a new argument to the topic, then there shouldn't be a problem... right?


Though, if it's just replying to a dead topic or something like that... then meh.
 
Actually you are just looking for a cheap way out ops, basically he is saying that you throw a tantrum and you know he is right that is why you start the namecalling. cheap.
 
Safim said:
Actually you are just looking for a cheap way out ops, basically he is saying that you throw a tantrum and you know he is right that is why you start the namecalling. cheap.
Click to expand...
I'm sorry, I could not understand a word there. Is there supposed to be one sentance or two? Maybe three?


And cheap way out of what? The topic was done. No one had cared for 6 days. We'd said our parts. Then fanboy l33t shows up and starts into me. So again, cheap way out of what? I don't believe that the postion of not buying a book sight unseen is a bad postion. You don't usually buy cars without looking at them first. Or a house. Hell, people  will spend more time looking over stuff at Wal*Mart than some fans spend looking at a RPG before purchase.
 
I guess that's part of the point though.  You seem to have some objections about the book already, sight unseen.  Folks are just letting you know that some of your fears should be allayed.  


It's not really a cheap shot, especially since not everyone posts everyday, or keeps a window open to the site when they're working at home.  *cough*cough*ignore the bald man*


Folks open up threads when it strikes their fancy.  One of the nice things about threads, is that you can pick them back up again.  No hoo hoo.


Tetchy.
 
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