Overpowered Villans vs. Several Exalted (Problems).

[Aedryan]

I'd love to ask for some more input but I think one of my players has been browsing around here for his own ideas and help for a campaign he might run so I'd be afraid he'd stumble upon this lol.


Not that he's searching for my topics, stumbling is the keyword.

 

[Persell]

Well, if he is a good one he will play the surprised or not read on anyway so I think you are safe here

 

[Flagg]

Just start a thread, and tell him not to read it.


-S

 

[Aedryan]

Well in my troupe we've got 2 dawn caste solars, 1 eclipse caste solar, 1 water aspect dragon-blood, 1 changing moon lunar, and a soulsteel caste alchemical.


We've finally gotten to the last adventure of my interpretation for the autochthonian invasion campaign that takes off from all three of the autocthonian scenarios. Over the course of the campaign they have grown very powerful and have taken down sidereal, abyssal, and solar circles without coming to significantly close to death.


The last villain of the campaign is going to be the First and Forsaken Lion who has since entered Kadar and is twisting it in his own fashion while they've been away recalibrating the manses.


I'm wondering if it's to foolish to think they could beat him, even bending the rules a little. I've read both Solar vs. Lion threads in the exalted wiki and I was hoping to get some more real feedback from you guys for this situation.

 

[Persell]

I'd say approaching a deathlord before your essence hits 6 or 7 is pretty much suicide, even more so with a dragon blooded in the group. I'd expect a deathlord to wait with stacked defenses and some friends. Even without friends the first and forsaken lion still has his essence stealing blade, 10 motes per hit, even a single well placed attack combo can drain a high essence solar pretty fast.


So, in my opinion you will have to cheat heavily or you kill the group in a direct confrontation.

 

[Jakk Bey]

Since when do you have to have a villain go mano a mano?  


How many great villains roll up and volunteer their chins?  Plans get foiled, schemes get ruined, giant monster machines go haywire, and the villain scoots out the back, or is hoist on his own petard, the Giant Monster Critter of Doom hauls the villain down to a what appears to be a watery grave, only to return in the Next Exciting Episode.


How many times does Doom really fight the Fantastic Four?  Doombots galore, but does Doom sully his own hands, often?  


Don't think so much in terms of direct confrontation--more about plans.  More about drama.  Think in terms of nice Story.

 

[Persell]

Uuuh Jakk, was that aimed at me?

 

[Aedryan]

Well the thing is, is that this is the end. When autocthon's facilities start back up and he joins the players in their goal to create a brighter tomorrow together out of the mess of the locust crusade, the world needs to know that the deathlords aren't immortal and that they can be fought, and killed.


They were only supposed to weaken him to a certain point that the breach in the final sequence of recalibration could be fixed and autocthon's avatar himself could appear and send the Lion reeling off into the mouth of oblivion, giving him final death.


I've still got 2 weeks to figure out this ending so I've got some time.

 

[Silence In Daylight]

If you don't plan to have the PCs deal the killing blow to Lion, using them only to weaken him so that Autochthon can bop him upside the head seems a bit anti-climactic.


 You say that the PCs have taken down Circles of Exalts. So, build a Circle that'll challenge them. They don't have to be all of one type--I can't imagine that Lion doesn't have any non-Abyssals under his banner. Give them artifacts, hearthstones, custom charms, well-considered combos, and other buffs (Siddie astrology comes to mind--include a Siddie with the Circle, complete with several Siddie MAs). Ignore the Essence 5 limit on young Exalts--this is the final battle, after all.


 Let the PCs encounter Lion and his chief lieutenants, and scare the party a bit by implying that they'll have to take down Lion--supported by his Essence 7+ helpers.


 Once they stop gibbering, use Auto as deus ex machina to distract Lion, and the party takes on Lion's lieutenants. If and when they win the battle, give them the cut scene of Auto taking down Lion in dramatic fashion.

 

[Aedryan]

Thanks that sounds pretty decent and I've considered that a bit as well, but I'll definately give it more thought now.


The thing is it would be very difficult for the PC's do deliver a final death killing blow as he would just reappear in the underworld if he met death at their hands. Giving them an artifact that could ultimately kill him is possible so I want to muse on that a bit as well.

 

[Persell]

The chief lieutenant of the lion is a deathlord, too...

 

[Jakk Bey]

The PCs can have a job to do though.  Their part in an intricate plan to bring the Deathlord down.  Not just rolling in and facing TFaFL's Goon Squad, but an actual task--say setting up a device that will allow Auto's main Essence Cannon or other thingie to target his citadel with a Void Bomb or other super destructo device?  They have to shut down a defense?  They have to get an item into his palace, or weaken his defenses enough to allow the Big Battle to occur, with better terms to their side than a straight up fight.


If Auto just shows up and takes the glory after the PCs have wet themselves, that's no fun, but if they are a part of the fun, and have their own tasks, and important ones that the victory hinges on, then they're satisfied.


Think taking down the generators in Return of the Jedi.  Think the entire plot of Republic Commando--four man squad sets up the conditions that let the glory hogs roll in, but without some legwork, the Jedi and the rest would have just been meat on the stick.  Think any heist flick you care to remember--everyone has a role to play, and it's all important for the payday.  Yes, the safecracker gets all the attention, but what about the folks who deliver the damn safe to him?  Who sweated and dodged and got it past mooks, cops, and out of a river?  


Give your PCs their glory time, and give them a vital role, other than just killing Abyssals.  Give them a task that hinges victory--and that might just be spoiling a ritual that the Abyssals need to perform, if you can't come up with something really cool, or feed one of the Abyssals to the hungry machine that TFaFL needs to have running to make his dreams of empire a reality--and running against Auto, that might mean all sorts of nifty goodies that could get gummed up.  


Then, when they knock out the defenses or set up their jammer, or whatever goodie  you cook up, then the TFaFL is wide open for boot kick into the jimmy towards the Oblivion, and his eventual, and very wiley, escape from total anihillation...

 

[Silence In Daylight]

The chief lieutenant of the lion is a deathlord, too...

 Most powerful subordinate, certainly, but I don't quite see Lion making Princess Magnificent his second-in-command...she's not really that kind of character, as described. Troubleshooter extraordinaire, certes, but...

 

[Kajata]

Yeah, I think he's warey to avoid giving her too much power of command within his forces.  As I read it at least.


I've gotta agree with Jakk, but I also have to hide my head in shame.  Frequently in my stories the climax of the story come as the characters win teh big fight.  It's just as dangerous and often more fun to have something other than giving a severe beatdown, even to challenging opponents, that the players have to do.

 

[Aedryan]

Alright, well I've gotten plenty of support and assistance from you guys. I think I gotta lock myself up to write out what I'm gonna do. Thanks for all the help.