Minimum Damage

[The Boss]

So, if i Have a weapon with Minimum Damage 4 and i hit anyone with it, even if all the damage is soaked i still causing those Minimum Damage?


If yes, so i could kill a guy without need to worry about his soak, since those minimum damage is pos-soak, rigtha, and would not be negated.


I really like Exalted 2nd, but sometimes i get confused with those new rules.

 

[Zaramis]

This is correct, unless the guy has a Hardness rating that beats your total damage, then he takes no damage at all.

 

[The Boss]

Don't you guys think that this rule is a little unfair?


Well, a guy with Str 1 and a dagger with minimum damage 1 could kill a guy with Soak 30?

 

[wordman]

Well' date=' a guy with Str 1 and a dagger with minimum damage 1 could kill a guy with Soak 30?[/quote']
If that guy has a 5 Essence, his minimum damage is actually 5, assuming he gets through hardness.

 

[Quorlox]

Don't you guys think that this rule is a little unfair?
Well, a guy with Str 1 and a dagger with minimum damage 1 could kill a guy with Soak 30?

Assuming he has a Soak 30/0 Hardness, and if that's the case, he deserves to get killed by a dork.  

 

[Ker'ion]

Don't you guys think that this rule is a little unfair?
Well, a guy with Str 1 and a dagger with minimum damage 1 could kill a guy with Soak 30?

What of a guy with Strength 3, no Melee and a weapon that only inflicts +0L, but oddly has a minimum damage of 4 (maybe some really messed up Artifact, like a Smashfist with tiny blades instead of the big spikes), converting Bashing damage to Lethal.

 

[Thorn Darkblade]

Once again, why hardness is good. Anyways, I like minimum damage. It leaves those few damage dice as a chance. I mean, regular people beating impossible odds has always been a staple of myths, so, give those heroic mortals one die,

 

[Sherwood]

It has also been a staple of myths of the hero walking thru an army from whatever without taking a scratch.


Which, of course, is what hardness is all about.

 

[Quorlox]

What of a guy with Strength 3, no Melee and a weapon that only inflicts +0L, but oddly has a minimum damage of 4 (maybe some really messed up Artifact, like a Smashfist with tiny blades instead of the big spikes), converting Bashing damage to Lethal.

I don't think minimum damage can raise your damage level if it should be lower, such as in the above example.  If you have a raw damage of 2 after hitting; it doesn't increase because the character has a higher Essence.

 

[Samiel]

Indeed I agree: your essence is the minimum damage you can be reduced to, but not your minimum damage.


And consider that in order to get such a minimum damage effect you'd want an artifact, as mortal weapons don't do a minimum of 4. However, they can do up to 3 minimum. And rightly they should against normal superheavy, where all the plates in the world can't stop raw shock from inflicting harm. It's all about weight, which is why the sledge is overwhelming.


However, if your average overwhelming weapon is wielded by a mortal, it'll either be trivial to avoid or you will likely have a hardness in excess of their damage, in which case you ignore them totally.


Also, if minimum damage didn't exist combat against high-soak characters would be far, far too boring.

 

[Thorn Darkblade]

Also, if minimum damage didn't exist combat against high-soak characters would be far, far too boring.

I can see it now...a Solar in superheavy orichalcum plate just wading through a sea of angry extras, not a care in the world, sitting down and pulling out a picnic basket...

 

[Quorlox]

Also, if minimum damage didn't exist combat against high-soak characters would be far, far too boring.

High soak combined with a reasonable number of health levels makes for a really boring fight if there is only one ping die.

 

[Ker'ion]

Also' date=' if minimum damage didn't exist combat against high-soak characters would be far, far too boring.[/quote']
I can see it now...a Solar in superheavy orichalcum plate just wading through a sea of angry extras, not a care in the world, sitting down and pulling out a picnic basket...

I can sooooo see that happening!

 

[The Boss]

You guys talk about hardness


But hardness is only considered as the "first" part of the soak, isn't?


If the Hardness is trespassed it don't have anymore utility, rigtha?

 

[Flagg]

Hardness is intended to prevent "weak" attacks from penetrating the armor. It sets a minimum threshold for raw damage. Any attacks above this minimum resolve normally. Any attacks at or below this automatically fail to inflict damage.


-S

 

[The Boss]

Get it. Anyway i think on my game i will ignore this rule in some occasions.


But very thanks for answer guys.

 

[wordman]

Anyway i think on my game i will ignore this rule in some occasions.

Be careful on ignoring minimum damage. It sounds like an easy mechanic to get rid of, but its intertwined in werid ways with other mechanics. Some charms, for example, particularly those that manipulate hardness or double damage, become less effective without the minimum damage rule.

 

[Persell]

Yeah, I wouldn't do it if I were you.  Don't forget that one of the advantages of orichalcum, soulsteel, and starmetal is that they increase the hardness of artifact armor made from them.

 

[The Scorp]

Speaking of Minimum dam.....Overwhelming...Useless.


Discuss.


Personally Id rather see low numbers that ADD to minimum essence as Minumum damage.  All Overwhelming mundane weapon should be 1, artifacts should be 2 or 3 in some rare cases.  That way, an ability that was associated with the item doesnt loose its value.

 

[Flagg]

I really see few situations where a weapon's Overwhelming damage would apply.


-S

 

[Persell]

Speaking of Minimum dam.....Overwhelming...Useless.
Discuss.


Personally Id rather see low numbers that ADD to minimum essence as Minumum damage.  All Overwhelming mundane weapon should be 1, artifacts should be 2 or 3 in some rare cases.  That way, an ability that was associated with the item doesnt loose its value.

the overwhlming weapons are mostly for humans, so they can deal a bit more damage, while the overwhelming artifacts are for weak/begining exalts, whose essence is still lower then the artifact's overwhelming rating. the overwhelming is more of a handicap than a booster, though it's your call about how you use tham. just consider the 5-essence granddaiklave whielding dawn, who has a 9 dice in his minimal damage pool to against almost anything, and probably has enough pre-soak damage to overcome the hardness of almost anything

 

[The Boss]

Ok! I will pay attention to that, buddies.


Thanks for the advice.

 

[Zaramis]

I didn't like the Essence = Minimum damage in my game. It was simply too powerful  to always have 5-6 damage for people who are high essence, since they almost always went above hardness.


Instead, I made it 50% of your Essence rounded up as minimum damage. This means that you need to reach essence 5 to get 3 minimum damage, which makes overwhelming weapons a lot more useful. We're all happy about the change