Exalted Quality

[Wuffy]

Wow. I had been really worried about exalted for a while now.


Between the No love my Favorite caste was getting (Night).


The horror of the Sidereals charms.


the lack of consistence with a lot of charms and powers.


I was getting a little annoyed.


But I must say. I am VERY happy with Both Infernals (Just got it)


and Alchemicals which I got a couple weeks before that.


Yay Exalted is fun again.


Now I need to play in one of those campaigns.


But my dm is "Sick of the PC's are mega super heroic crazy powered dudes"


So we might be playing godlike now... *sigh*


I wish the Gamer pool out here wasn't so shallow.

 

[Chaka]

...the Night Caste has one of the best ability spreads in the whole game...

 

[Wuffy]

Oh absolutely has the best caste ability. (Now the Twilight has been errated to roll or 1)


I love it.


I more meant how it's got the most wimpy of caste charms overall.


Athletics is really the only decent charm tree in the lot.


Awareness is slightly under par simply because all it has is just extra success and maybe at the end a perect see through illusions, while I like Perfects, I want charms to be a variety of tools.


Dodge... Well Dodge has a perfect, and a few decent charms... But it's an ability that... You can't actually do much with at all... And yet, every other Exalt manages to create more dodge charms then Solars... (Bar Alchemicals, infernals and Lunars, since they do Charms differently and don't have a tree on dodge and the requirement to pad out the ability dodge isn't there.)


Mostly Stealth and Larceny or the most crippled shriveled short lists of charms in the entire book. Which is made worse simply because they could encompass all kinds of very interesting abilities.

 

[Pant's O' Doom]

*spills whatever he was drinking over self*


Night?


Eclipse have it the worst, unless you think everyone uses Bureaucracy, Ride and Sail charms constantly. Stealth and Larceny at least get some use.


And what's wrong with sid's charms? They were strange in 1e, and fluffwise they're supposed to Rube Goldberg-esq.

 

[Wuffy]

I'll give you bureaucracy is small crummy tree but ride and sail are pretty solid.


How often they get used depends on the campaign really.


You could be using both constantly.


Sid charms lost a lot of power from copy paste syndrome. They used to do all kinds of impressive convoluted narrow things, but they are missing some of the zaz since some of the effects weren't really replicated in the new mechanics.

 

[Pant's O' Doom]

Yea, but less than stealth or larceny.


Ride and sail are: I can do normal things, or things that are basically a stunt, but instead I use charms.


Larceny and Stealth are: I turn invisible and make magic lockpicks, magic disguises, and oh yea. I can walk through walls.

 

[Mei]

Hey, ride can MAKE a horse for you. I find that useful.


When you do as much running from stupidly dangerous stuff as our group does, that's damn useful.

 

[Wuffy]

Actually, it's I can walk through Doorways, not walls. Which is eh, and gets expensive real quick since it's one door per activation. What I'm talking about is how short and stubby the charm tree's are, not the skills themselves.


If you want to reach beyond, I'll just say Eclipse can learn the charms of everyone else Ride, sail and bureaucracy charms and become awesome. Since One of the Dragon blooded ones is "I know your perfect gift." A sail Charm for Sidereals. "What a coincidence you are going my way..."

 

[Chaka]

Actually, it's I can walk through Doorways, not walls. Which is eh, and gets expensive real quick since it's one door per activation. What I'm talking about is how short and stubby the charm tree's are, not the skills themselves.

Yeah, but the charms which you do get cover a lot of ground. Dodge has, what, four charms to it? But once you have them, you become bitch hard to hit.

 

[Tableface]

Nights have the most balanced spread of Caste Abilities in the game, but rely on their Favored Abilities to define themselves more than other castes.


Also: Eclipse Castes? Worst Ability spread? Bureaucracy crummy?


Are you people insane?


Using nothing but Bureaucracy and Socialize Charms, an Eclipse can walk into a city and within a month either have the entire place a riotous mess just waiting for the intervention of an outside force to save it (say, their circle) or rise to such a position of prominence that they could make the upcoming takeover entirely legal.


They can make banners that force everyone to fall in love with them, and (with a Combo) at the same time instill fanatical loyalty. Then they'll gather their sudden influx of followers together, march into the king's court, and debate his entire assembly into standing down.


They can purge all traces of government corruption, mount their horses, and ride off into the sunset, at the same time causing everyone to immediately dedicate their society's policies to the Eclipse.


They can perfectly defend their boats, and enchant said boats to sail unnoticed through the seas of Kimbery at near the speed of light (at higher essence). If they even needed to worry about it, since they can't be harmed by the Yozi if they're present on official business.


And then there's learning other Charms. The vast majority aren't useful to learn, since Solar Charms cost less and generally do better, but there's a handful worth learning.


Eclipses have one of the most influential Ability/Charm spreads, especially when coupled with their Anima powers.

 

[Chaka]

The problem with Bureaucracy in some people's minds is the lack of a solid system backing it up. *shrug* I personally have no problem with it.

 

[Sarky]

They can get neglected in a game that focuses more on beating things up than on politics/economics/societies/travelling/whatever. But goddamn, do they kick ass at that stuff.

 

[Cthulhu_Wakes]

I, for one, love games involving bureaucracy. One of my favorite games I've ever run focused solely on the day-to-day of a trio of Solars in Nexus. Back alley deals, opening businesses, inviting anyone and everyone in Nexus to a giant kegger in Nighthammer that quickly spread throughout the city? Then the murderous fight amongst cheering people against invaders from beyond? Epic. And that was just one session.

 

[Golentan]

Personally, I love Alchemicals (my very bestest most favoritest kind of exalt), so I'm with you there. But I also agree on the whole "No love for Night caste, are you joking?" thing going on.


I desperately need to play as an alchemical some more.

 

[Wuffy]

Personally, I love Alchemicals (my very bestest most favoritest kind of exalt), so I'm with you there. But I also agree on the whole "No love for Night caste, are you joking?" thing going on.
I desperately need to play as an alchemical some more.

I think there was a slight misunderstanding.


I never said night caste was bad, or under powered or any such things.


I was commenting merely that the charm tree's they had access to were fairly short and swift.


While other splats had all kinds of interesting and creative charms for Stealth and Larceny.


Dragon Blooded can voice mimic anyone, and forge documents


Lunars can toss things into Elsewhere


Sidereals have their shell games, dream stealing


Etc..


We as solars have, open locks, perfect disguis but it has to be a complete disguise nothing right off the cuff, meaning you need to prepare and walk through doors. While those are good and quick bases, it's a poor repertoire for the most glorious and skilled thieve/assassin on behalf of heaven.


There are new charms growing for many trees either through Ink monkeys, dedicated work by awesome fans, and some extra stuff coming out of the new published material, very little for Larceny and stealth, nothing new for awareness.


While dedicated fan work is reat and Ink monkeys is greatly appreciated, it's a lack of official release and the small charm selection that kind of annoys me.


Now if there have been new charms created and released in official books I missed then I'm sorry but far as I know mostly we have a few new mirrors from Abyssal book. and a few from DotFA which near everyone out of hand says not having any of it.


Going round and round in circles trying to say, Solars are awesome but were designed first of second edition and a lot of their stuff is a little bland, as we go along the line the other Exalts got a lot of very flavorful and interesting charms. I don't know about you but waiting till 3rd edition is a little eh.


Yes I can make my own charms, but thats not what this post is about, It was meant to be a vent at the act official sources aren't really giving anything new to the Night caste while other castes seem to be getting a nice selection of new charms, some starting with a really expansive and awesome selection. It was not a comment on poor ability selection, not about bad anima power... Just a comment on short uncreative and unexpanded charm tree's.

 

[Red Shadow Claws]

Since all Ink Monkeys material has to be approved before it's released, I'd say it's pretty official.


Yes, the Solar Charmset is lacking, mainly because it was the first set to be written, but also because they had to cover the basics. I haven't delved much into it, but look into 1000 Correct Actions, I know there are supposed to be a few hidden Solar and Abyssal Charms there, not sure if any of them are in Larceny or Stealth though.


And as per the last Ink Monkeys, which dealt with Sail and Ride quite a bit, and made them more awesome, I'd remain hopeful for such a treatment for Stealth and Larceny as well.

 

[d1ng0d0g]

Night Castes are among my favorite of the Solar Exalted, but only because in some games they might just have the second most powerful caste ability around.


They can just be incredibly awesome at whatever they do without anyone being able to figure out what they do.


As for the games where they are expected to be full combat monkeys, there's so many tricks an agile fast fighter can pull and not all of them require the fighter to be at range.


The trick is using the terrain surrounding you to your advantage. It was one of the reasons my last table-top Storyteller ambushed my Night Caste character at the beach. With an entire group of Dragon-Blooded Immaculates (one from each Aspect) and several cronies, mostly so he couldn't get away.


He only got out of the ambush because he knew it was an ambush when he walked in, because of his awareness charms. (Hearing oriented). And because one of the abilities he was good in normally was linguistics. Guess what ... a native Flametongue speaker has a different accent from a native High Realm speaker. Okay, he also had back-up several minutes away in the form of an entire circle.


Then the timing of walking into the ambush. He walked into it the moment the sun went down from the sky, from that direction. There was also plenty of kicking up sand, using cronies as cover (and at one point even one of the Dragon-Blooded). During the fight he also swiped the clothes from one of the extras and then 'looked' like the extras, enough to cause another distraction. Just a slight use of a presence charm actually caused hesitation in one of the Dragon Blooded.


Anyways, I'm not regaling you all with the full description of what happened there. Suffice it to say that for several rounds the Night Caste survived without showing that he was Anathema to the Dragon-Blooded (he actually never showed his Exalted state, not even once during the entire game). And then the circle came to the rescue, with the players actually grinning broadly at the number of stunts I pulled off. And that was mostly empty terrain.


Night Castes are perhaps the strongest, but you need to use their charms and skills to the maximum.

 

[xarvh]

WTF!?


BLASPHEMY!!


Is there even any point at all in playing non-night castes!?


As a proud player of a Day Abyssal entirely defined by her Day Caste abilities (no dawn abilities) I am offended by your statements.


Dodge has 4 charms because they already do everything you need.


I mean, what can you add after "Dodge everything, always"!?


Hell, buy it a second time to get around the flaw!


The Athletics Tree is just awesome, it allows so much wire-fu-stunts that I cannot even imagine having a character without Graceful Crane Stance.


You can break havoc among your enemies just with that.


Stealth?


Invisible Statue Spirit is just awesome, especially combined with athletic charms, and the GotMH:US expands it to new heights of awesomeness.


Larceny needs just something to somehow get past the "no attuned artifacts" limit.


Read the GotMH:US.


Racing The Sun anyone?


Regarding the Eclipse, while I love them so much, there is nothing that Sail/Ride can do that can't be done with a single artifact or transport spell.


And bureaucracy is very difficult to handle.. Investing there is a gamble on the master ability, if you end up with an idiot you will have wasted your points.

 

[MorkaisChosen]

The Athletics Tree is just awesome, it allows so much wire-fu-stunts that I cannot even imagine having a character without Graceful Crane Stance.
You can break havoc among your enemies just with that.

Agree muchly. It's a very rare character of mine that doesn't favour Athletics...

 

[Wuffy]

With the release of the New Errata re workig MANY of the DotFA charms. I am Happier.


Larceny and Stealth charms now expanded and do more like I was making noise about earlier even though everyone seemed to say I was daft to think so.


Lots of updated charms, but mostly a lot of complete rebuilt from the ground up charms.


Solar glory almighty indeed.


Some of the charms. Holy crap...


Permanent Upgrades to charms some would discard, hungry tiger might as well be renamed Murderous rending now...

 

[Cryoseraph]

I'm personally so much happier with the original Exalts over the wacky new ones (Infernal and Alchemical), but that's mostly due to how charm trees are written and explained. Ability separation is much easier to follow than the attribute separations or the theme separations. Ironically, I love the Lunars tons as well.


I've always loved the Night Caste first and foremost (my 1st character was one), and wholeheartedly agree that Athletics and Awareness are tons of fun. I was never big on the Larceny or Stealth for him either, probably because of the small trees, and jumped into melee quickly on him.


Sidereals probably need a proper rebalancing to make sure they flow right. And for me that might take seeing what a 'balanced Sidereal' does by way of a couple of examples. How much destiny/college stuff do they wear? Then they have their charms, which are a bit all over the place for getting the control over on gods and elementals at times, while other times seem spot-on awesome for destiny powered exalts. I think a bigger problem for them is that the most basic charms (Excellencies and Ox-Body) for them are the weakest types. Dice cap is Essence? Even after spending to negate penalties first, that's harsh. And the cool charms cost a ton, weird for a group that shouldn't show off much. And then the official response for no new Sidereal stuff in Dreams of First Age was they use more martial arts and spells than other types since they have no new charms. Sensible, but still sad. So while I love Siddies, they are the least charm-using of any group I'd think of. I could see many a PC going all colleges and spell casting on a game, with another playing up the Connections and Martial Arts, and another still only using charms to make his social wrangling in Yu-Shan easier, without any full commitments to charm trees. Granted, I think all three of those sound like fun, James Bond is loved for his new toys and such, not his ability to be a crack-shot after all.

 

[Fiaryn]

I think the only thing that consistently drives me up the wall in Exalted is how...completely terrible the Full Moon Lunar anima effect is. It's not very useful for their role

 

[xarvh]

Full Moon anima is ridiculously useful in combat as it basically allows them to decide at which distance, if at all, the combat takes place.


You can close in to ranged foes or stay away from melee ones.


You can pursue enemies or flee from them... Couple that with shapeshifting, it is pretty hard to escape from a Full Moon.


The feats of strength thing allows you to wield Ridiculously Oversized Weapons , especially improvised ones.


Tear away the metal gates of a fortress, use them to parry the attacks and throw them after some other enemy...


This is Exalted, double strength opens the door to countless awesome stunts.


And here I am considering only the combat uses...

 

[Fiaryn]

Wielding ridiculously oversized weapons is already easily done on a more consistent basis via Glories of the Most High charms. While the feats of strength thing is cool, I've never found combat distance to be a huge issue. Thus my lack of being impressed at Run Real Fast.

 

[Chaka]

You haven't lived until you've torn yourself out of the wreckage of your moonsilver warstrider, then picked up its daiklaive and continued the fight.