Curing the Great Curse - and then what?

[Kremlin KOA]

That was the whole point, Solfi - that there isn't a cure for the Great Curse and any quest for it would be futile.  The Great Curse would be as intrinsic in Creation as life as death is.  It's part of nature and the absence of the Great Curse is actually an aberration, not a fix.  But that's just my opinion of it.

then you miss one of the core concepts of Exalted


the PCs CAN make a difference in Exalted, unlike in WoD

 

[Persell]

then you miss one of the core concepts of Exalted
the PCs CAN make a difference in Exalted, unlike in WoD

Not at all.  I understand that the Exalted can make a difference.  The reason why is because of the tremendous power they have.  What I also realize is that power corrupts.  That, too, is a core concept in Exalted.  The major way it is utilized is through the Great Curse.  If they won't use their power for virtuous ends then their power will cause them to become monsters.  That's a concept that is used in nearly all of WW's games and one that I, personally, don't like taken out of Exalted.


But this thread isn't about that so I will keep my opinions about it out of this thread.


If you are looking for a way to take out the Great Curse, you could say that the Yozis have the power to do it.  Yes, the Great Curse was cast by the Neverborn, but they are at the same level as the Yozis.  Therefore, it could be possible for the Yozis to recall the Curse, much like a Solar could counter the sorcery of another Solar.

 

[Kremlin KOA]

Actually the idea that the power is inhertently corrupting is only really in WoD, in their Scarn Sagas power did not inherently corrupt but corruption was waiting for the unwary


that is more how exalted should be... if you decide that a quest the PCs decide to go on is impossible, no matter how long and hard they struggle.. you are out of epic myth and into Ann Rice style Emo books.


in Epic Myth there is always a way, even if the price is high


an example would be send the Neverborn to oblivion and all they wrought disappears, no more shadowlands or underworld... many ghosts follow them to oblivion and the rest go to lethe, and the curse ends, with the abbyssal shards becoming solar shards once more


now the hard part is shoving the entire labyrinth into oblivion


many solars would have to give their lives to do that one


another might be gunboat diplomacy on the Yozi's, now how much effort do you trhink it would be to unite enough exalts for an assault on malfeas, and then to hold the yozi's fetiches at daiklaive-point how many DECADES or CENTURIES of play would that encompass... a tale worthy of homer.


it could be that it will require making friends with Autochthon. how long a campaign to wake the guy up, show that even with this curse the new soplars are trying to be good, and that the horrors the solars did in  the past were a result of said curse


in conclusion, while the difficulty and length of a quest shoudl be commensurate with the goal, no quest should be impossible

 

[Solfi]

 What I also realize is that power corrupts.  That, too, is a core concept in Exalted. The major way it is utilized is through the Great Curse.

... but the Great Curse is an external influence.

If they won't use their power for virtuous ends then their power will cause them to become monsters.

... not really. Always acting in a virtuous manner won't save you from the Great Curse. Acting in a accordance with your major virtue will. But that is hardly the virtuous thing to do, in every situation. Hence the tragedy.

If you are looking for a way to take out the Great Curse, you could say that the Yozis have the power to do it.  Yes, the Great Curse was cast by the Neverborn, but they are at the same level as the Yozis.  Therefore, it could be possible for the Yozis to recall the Curse, much like a Solar could counter the sorcery of another Solar.

But they might not be on the same level as the Neverborn, as they were diminished by their imprisonment. But hey, it's a viable idea. Though going that road would have to exact a price of epic proportions... and probably not be worth it.

 

[Gtroc]

The main question I have is how would the Exalts figure out the great curse? I mean, seriously, how would you go about that? personally I would say that Lytek has hatched a plan to cleanse the taint on exalted shards, and he begins, subtly mind you, to give the characters hints, omens, prophesies or what have you. now once they get over the initial hurdle of figuring it out, I imagine that the exalts(I imagine it would be Solars, though it might be another kind, or even a mixed group) would then folow classic playerism, and  go completely linear in there thinking. either they would go directly to the yozis or work their way through the Yozis minions untill they got an answer they liked. while curing the great curse would be hard, the basic premiss in Exalted is that the characters have the potential to do anything. I mean, they killed the Primordials! which was fundementally impossible, a little thing like "the great curse" heck they could do that with minimal loss of life, and few expenses...reletively speaking of course. the main problem I see is how they would even learn of the curse in the first place.

 

[memesis]

If they won't use their power for virtuous ends then their power will cause them to become monsters.

... not really. Always acting in a virtuous manner won't save you from the Great Curse. Acting in a accordance with your major virtue will. But that is hardly the virtuous thing to do, in every situation. Hence the tragedy.

GCG was fairly clear on one point regarding Virtues:  they are neither "good" nor "evil" in a traditional moral sense.  So I would be careful about using words like "virtue" or "virtuous" without a clear understanding of the connotation.

 

[memesis]

The main question I have is how would the Exalts figure out the great curse?

There's several options.


* Lytek, Taru-Han, the Maiden of Secrets, or some other influential figure recruits the Circle to assist in solving the issue.


* Autochthon or one of his lesser beings, servants, etc. decides to engage the Circle on the subject (one way or another).


* The Circle discovers evidence the Deliberative uncovered, but did not act on.


* The Circle becomes aware of a Sidereal theory which would explain the madness of the Solars that led to the Usurpation - perhaps the Gold Faction has been researching the topic.


* A Solar, such as Samea, calls forth and compels a Third Circle Demon to chronicle its role in the First Age, to get a better understanding of that time.   One of the things it speaks of is the Great Curse.

 

[Gtroc]

Never said there were not options available, I was merely pointing out that all of the arguments seem to take the knowledge of the great curse for granted. I believe that figuring out the great curse would be the first step, and so I think it deserves a little more focus. just my thoughts on this though.

 

[memesis]

Never said there were not options available, I was merely pointing out that all of the arguments seem to take the knowledge of the great curse for granted. I believe that figuring out the great curse would be the first step, and so I think it deserves a little more focus. just my thoughts on this though.

Most of the options I presented do not presume knowledge of the Great Curse.  "Tell me what you demons did during the First Age with regard to the Solars." "Well, we watched as you destroyed yourselves with the Great Curse..."  "The Great what?"

 

[Solfi]

The main question I have is how would the Exalts figure out the great curse? I mean, seriously, how would you go about that? personally I would say that Lytek has hatched a plan to cleanse the taint on exalted shards, and he begins, subtly mind you, to give the characters hints, omens, prophesies or what have you.

... well, given that Lytek is responsible for the pruning of the Exaltations, he could manipulate them so that memories of pertinent events that hint at the problem bleed through. Doesn't get more subtle than that, in regards to others being aware of what he's doing...

 

[Sherwood]

No matter what is done, it is still going to be difficult for any Exalt to learn about the curse.  Harder still when you ask 'What Exalt of any kind in Creation has the ability to convince others that there is a curse and that something should be done about it.'  The Sidereals are effected by knowing that what they are doing is right.  The Dragon-Bloods are under the control of the Immaculate Order.  The Solars are scattered, hunted, and lost, struggling just to learn the basics of their power.  The Lunars don't care about civilization, being happy living out in the borderlands.  The Abyssals are under the control of their Deathlords, and they are servants of the beings that placed the curse in the first place.