Hypnos
L'Empereur
You know, out of all the things that happened in season six, that was one of the things I hated the most.
It's about time!
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- Thread starter Hypnos
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It's about time!
WanderingJester
Cool shuppy waddling away from explosions
Oh, he'll get over some... thing...
I mean, he'll get something in his... fat...
Crap, I'm sorry guys. I'mma need a break; I'm running dry atm.
TheAncientCelt
The Leech Lord
So it's settled. The Early Lord Waltur Frey shall take up the heavy burden of taxing everyone who crosses his bridges!
diwa
hiraya manawari
The pie thing? What's to hate? It's actually funny. They showed that revenge is sweet. *badum tss*
TheAncientCelt
The Leech Lord
Funny, you say? Pray tell me, ser, do you find the tale of the Rat Cook humorous as well? It was a savage and tragic display, once more cementing in the hearts and minds of the whole realm that the Starks are nothing but rabid dogs who must be put down. Permanently.
Lord Walder's untarnished, honorable self died a fate far below a man of his status. I hope only that Ser Twenty avenges our Lord Ramsay Bolton and flays Arya Stark living.
Hypnos
L'Empereur
It was so over the top and completely ridiculous! Putting aside the fact that Arya managed to get from Braavos to the Twins in the first place, she managed to kill both Freys, sneak into the Twins staff and cook them into pies without anyone noticing. For goodness sake you could still see body parts in the pies, she had to have cooked them somewhere, where was that? She can't cook pies, when did she have time to learn? And then she just murdered Lord Walder and i imagine she'll get away scot free. I just don't think she earned that revenge in any meaningful way.
Another gripe of mine is the show's tendency to try to get you to emphasise with Arya even when she's killing people. A prime example of this was Meryn Trant who suddenly became the devil just before Arya killed him for no reason. The show purposely made the Freys incompetent when some of them were not just so the show watchers could laugh at the funny men in the funny hats.
But anyway, that's just my opinion.
Another gripe of mine is the show's tendency to try to get you to emphasise with Arya even when she's killing people. A prime example of this was Meryn Trant who suddenly became the devil just before Arya killed him for no reason. The show purposely made the Freys incompetent when some of them were not just so the show watchers could laugh at the funny men in the funny hats.
But anyway, that's just my opinion.
diwa
hiraya manawari
Yes, it's funny. I have a dark sense of humor after all. I have no love for Starks, I just find it funny.
Also...
Akio
Lord of Naptime
I swear half the conversation is done in gifts here
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diwa
hiraya manawari
Err... where did she learn? I guess what happens in the House of Black and White, stays in the House of Black and White.
Hypnos
L'Empereur
To be honest I think I would have rather watched learn to cook pies for a season than what we did get.
TheAncientCelt
The Leech Lord
@Hypnos
A lot of season 6 feels like that, to me. The writing is a massive step down from the last good season (4), thinks seem to happen for convenience sake and the plot just expects us to suspend our disbelief and accept that the arduous process of Arya learning these things, studying these men, and eventually killing them/baking them/studying the habits of Walder Frey's court, was all off screen. It would've been an entire seasons build up for this. I don't like it one bit and I think without George there to keep things grounded and get more of the ASOIAF spirit in GoT, it's been a frighteningly fast degradation of what made GoT popular for seasons of. . . Yara hitting on Dany.
It's pandering in a lot of scenes and the acting isn't always top notch, either. Don't get me wrong. Some of the scenes and episodes are great. Bastard Bowl? Easily one of the best battle reenactments to date. Cersei's escapades at the end of the season? Loved'em. Even if they still totally. . Made null the entire Tyrell subplot for three seasons now. It's only gonna get worse too. They wanna cram in more epic and cinematic scenes without the proper build up and expect that to have the same weight as, say, the Battle for the Wall, Joffery's death, the Red Wedding, Ned's execution, The Battle of Blackwater bay. Them having only 7 episodes this season and 6 the next will really turn GoT into more of a cheaper Fantasy Movie rather than the epic it was, IMO.
A lot of season 6 feels like that, to me. The writing is a massive step down from the last good season (4), thinks seem to happen for convenience sake and the plot just expects us to suspend our disbelief and accept that the arduous process of Arya learning these things, studying these men, and eventually killing them/baking them/studying the habits of Walder Frey's court, was all off screen. It would've been an entire seasons build up for this. I don't like it one bit and I think without George there to keep things grounded and get more of the ASOIAF spirit in GoT, it's been a frighteningly fast degradation of what made GoT popular for seasons of. . . Yara hitting on Dany.
It's pandering in a lot of scenes and the acting isn't always top notch, either. Don't get me wrong. Some of the scenes and episodes are great. Bastard Bowl? Easily one of the best battle reenactments to date. Cersei's escapades at the end of the season? Loved'em. Even if they still totally. . Made null the entire Tyrell subplot for three seasons now. It's only gonna get worse too. They wanna cram in more epic and cinematic scenes without the proper build up and expect that to have the same weight as, say, the Battle for the Wall, Joffery's death, the Red Wedding, Ned's execution, The Battle of Blackwater bay. Them having only 7 episodes this season and 6 the next will really turn GoT into more of a cheaper Fantasy Movie rather than the epic it was, IMO.
TheFordee20
One Thousand Club
I actually agree but disagree in a way. I don't mind that Arya did that. In-fact, as a major Stark fanboy/i- I was shocked ( in a good way ) when that happened.
But as I've thought about it over time, I found it completely stupid in-terms of writing. Like I know D&D wanted another big "omfg wtf yas" moment, but I wish they would've showed us Arya arriving in Westeros and travelling to The Twins earlier. Instead of showing us one glimpse of some random servant girl and then BAM-- she's Arya. We should've seen Arya get to The Twins and plan her kill instead of it just being completely out of the blue.
TBH though, Arya's storyline in S6 past Episode 5 was a nightmare.
I also agree on Meryn. Yeah, he was a douche. But they made him into a child touching douche just so casual viewers would love Arya even more for killing him. We shouldn't be loving Arya for killing people. It is wrong. She is becoming a monster. Her quest for vengeance is clearly polluting her. Same goes for Cersei. Everyone I know LOVED how Cersei came out on top at the end of Season 6.
I loved it too. But I still hate her. She is an evil bitch and she killed thousands and thousands of nobles in one go. We shouldn't be applauding that sort of stuff.
TheAncientCelt
The Leech Lord
Arya's storyline past Season 4 was a nightmare.
Hypnos
L'Empereur
Yeah, I know a lot of people loved this season, and I can understand why, but I just didn't enjoy it. The end of the season especially seemed incredibly rushed, when everyone just join team Dany in an instant. Even some of the things that I did think were alright seemed rushed and unexplained, like how Cersei claimed absolute power after killing everyone else in the city. How did she retain the support of the Lannister men after that, I'm fairly certain everyone in the city didn't go brain dead, it should be fairly obvious who just did all that murder.
The show has clear biases as to who are important and it really shows. Bastard bowl got an entire episode, Stannis v the Boltons got five minutes. Dorne wasn't well recieved in season five, instead of fixing it they just shoved it under a rug and tried to make people forget about it.
I really want to love the show, and sometimes I do, but at the same time I also hate it.
The show has clear biases as to who are important and it really shows. Bastard bowl got an entire episode, Stannis v the Boltons got five minutes. Dorne wasn't well recieved in season five, instead of fixing it they just shoved it under a rug and tried to make people forget about it.
I really want to love the show, and sometimes I do, but at the same time I also hate it.
TheFordee20
One Thousand Club
I don't really have much to say on it in Season 5. It was just kinda' there. However, I did love the first few episodes of Season 6. Lady Crane was a very good character, I thought. And I loved the way the plays showed the events that we all know and love. Plus, when Arya recovered needle and blew out the candle at the end of one of the episodes. I was cheering. Then it all went downhill when she got stabbed and started parkouring through-out the city.
Oh and then there's the whole...
"You are now truly no one."
I am someone who loves to study literature and writing, and the meaning behind every single action or word a character says/does. But I still cannot fucking understand what the hell Jaqen meant by that. Especially when Season 6 was all about her discovering that she cannot let go of her identity as Arya Stark. Maybe he means she thinks she is Arya, but she has changed so much that she never will be again... or something... ?
I honestly go blank.
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TheAncientCelt
The Leech Lord
This season had a plethora of plot holes that, frankly, always have been around. But the writing is not what it use to be, either for them to try and move towards the end game quickly, or because the lack of source material is hurting them. One of the two, I'm sure. But these issues are glaring an when I start to think on a scene or episode, it takes me out of it. It's just. . .At the forefront of everything. The Terminator Waif, while funny, was just. . I hated that. So much. The show seems to be done with the quiet, character building scenes too. No more of the Hound and Arya, or Jaime and Brienne. We just don't get those kinds of moments, and I really,. . The show feels remarkably different from earlier seasons. Just the atomosphere and levity sucked from it. Things are bigger and badder, which isn't really my taste. Every character needs to be a bad ass and get those cool lines, poses, or outfits. Which is a big reason why I love Sam. He's so different from every other character since season 5, and lovable too. Oh, the writers make no attempt to hide who they chose as queen. The spoilers (a LOT of video and picture evidence) of the next season wants to make me gag. I'll watch it. Find a handful of scenes enjoyable. But I just want the real story now.
Lady Crane and the Mummers Guild was enjoyable. It was a nice detraction and felt like Arya's story would finally feature. . Characters with real personalities. Not sogging cut outs made from cardboard. Apart from that, there's absolutely nothing good can say about Arya's time in Braavos. The pay off was subpar, in my belief. The time spent, we didn't learn too much. The blindness was quickly cured and she is no more stealthier now than before she went there. In Season 2 with Tywin she showed a comparable level of proficiency with being deceitful and sneaky. I can understand how you can like it all, but to me, it feels undeserved. She seems to spend time there, get relatively nothing done, and then go home being some master class assassin who. . The Faceless men would allow to leave and not be killed, holding their secrets and a knowledge of their chamber? Sorry, Arya's face is being added to the wall next, if she did that in the book.
Just. .it's frustrating for me.
Hypnos
L'Empereur
One problem is that what made the show popular is that anyone could die, it was a major selling point for the show, and it used to be how people advertised it to friends. That's just not true anymore, there are a handful of characters who are immune to death and it's pretty obvious at this point.
There's still a few things that I liked, I actually really enjoyed most of the scenes in Horn Hill with Randyll Tarly,, but for every one of those scenes there's five Doran's death, Frey pies, or whatever the fuck Dany did last season.
There's still a few things that I liked, I actually really enjoyed most of the scenes in Horn Hill with Randyll Tarly,, but for every one of those scenes there's five Doran's death, Frey pies, or whatever the fuck Dany did last season.
TheAncientCelt
The Leech Lord
Can we be real for a moment?
When the fuck was Dany likable? Season 1, some parts of season 2 and most of season 3? She's always been a god damn irritating character to watch on screen. I like her more in the books because, even when she comes off as an ignorant little girl, we're reminded she's 16 and spent most of her life running and fleeing for her life. She has more character and personality there, then what Emelia Clark (whom I like. But she doesn't do the character justice. That, or the writing is utter garbage for Dany. Might be both) portrays. Almost every scene with Dany is, "women's power!" Sure. Cool. Nothing against that. But we get it. Don't remind me that it's weird for a woman to be in power in a medieval society. Don't pull at your own damn seams, GoT.
Hypnos
L'Empereur
She used to be tolerable at least, never my favourite but never my least favourite either. But the issue is that since she's so far away from everyone else, everything she does just feels inconsequential and boring. If Essos was the only part of the show I wouldn't watch it because Essos is dull. My favourite parts of GoT are the political aspects and there is none of that in Essos (well I guess there is sort of but I don't care enough to learn the name of every Harzoo and Harzooette.
TheFordee20
One Thousand Club
I think I've said it before here, but I personally like Doran's death scene. I can 100% see why everyone is angry. But I am biased to Indira Varma and her acting as Ellaria in that scene was just chillingly good to me.
I like how they alluded to the fact that Doran wasn't all that loved. And the way his guards stared at him as he lay dying was just great. However, it loses a lot of points in that there wasn't enough exposition. We should of seen signs that Doran wasn't that liked during Season 5. But we got no evidence of that from his smallfolk. It also works if you view Show Ellaria like I do. I honestly think Ellaria has been lustful for power for a long time. She loved Oberyn, yes. But I feel as if she purposely made a big deal about his death so that she could challenge Doran and his position as ruler of Dorne. This was her plan all along. Who knows, even when Oberyn was alive- she could of been plotting. Of course this is just my head-canon and doesn't really come across in the show much, if at all.
Plus, it loses more points when you know that they just seemed to do that because of the backlash from Season 5.
Now the scene on the boat with Barbaro, Nymeria, and Trystane? That was a fucking travesty.
diwa
hiraya manawari
Dany is a character that has either lame and boring moments or a badass moments. Nothing in between. I think that is her essence. She was driven out from her home, they stole her rightful crown and people looks down on women and thinking that they can't rule. And she is breaking those beliefs. If she can't portray that ideal then her whole character is useless.
TheAncientCelt
The Leech Lord
I enjoy Essos for what it is, I think that's an area that the show could've actually made better plot lines for. The Green Grace and The Harpy in the book are all stalling techniques to keep Dany from going to Westeros too soon. That's apparent, considering the middle book in the original trilogy was gonna be Dany invading Westeros. But, I think any alternative or detraction from the plot that may have. . Served as a character building moment for Dany, would've been better. When she plays ruler for three seasons now and doesn't change a bit, except to be occasionally more bitchy, I lose interest. Quick.
Essos in general is. . Barren. And I don't wanna see big episodes of it exclusively. I'd rather get it sprinkled along with one or two big moments each season. The same reason you dislike it. And I too am in it for the political machinations. But, Essos does have an allure for me. I like the world building of it and I enjoy seeing it. I just wish there was more time spent with clearly. . Political and important characters. Cutting Young Griff from the story certainly didn't help. I understand adding him would've meant at least another. . Ten episodes. probably fifteen, to the overall show. But the Golden Company and another Targaryen would've made it all the better in Essos. Have Young Griff go East instead of West and cause some turmoil in Dany.
TheAncientCelt
The Leech Lord
I get that, I understand what she's suppose to be doing. They remind us so often. It's just. . A mix of it being hammered in, her character not changing and growing dull, and her "badass moment" is now a meme. She randomly gave a speech to the Dothraki because the writers thought it'd look cool. Scenes like that with her offer nothing, and the aspect that everyone alive wants to bang her (semi-understandable. Attractive young woman, queen, dragons. Plenty of reasons to wanna be with her. Buttt), for no reason other than seemingly loving her instead of lusting after what she has, is silly.
She's a bland character who's easily out done by Brienne in all these traits and set goals. Brienne the Beauty, even if her recent actions don't make total sense, embodies those messages to a fuller extent that is significantly more pleasing to watch and indisputably a better character.
Tl
RViserys should've lived.
Stannis was the true king.
Hypnos
L'Empereur
People are usually confused when I say that I like Stannis. They talk about how he burned his daughter and how at some points he wasn't the best human being in the world, but when I say I like Stannis it's not necicarily because I always agree with him or his motives, it's because his character is actually interesting. The same thing could be said for Tywin, Roose or even Walder, they may not be the nicest characters but at least they offer something other than "Young attractive badass does something really cool and morally right"
diwa
hiraya manawari
I get that, I understand what she's suppose to be doing. They remind us so often. It's just. . A mix of it being hammered in, her character not changing and growing dull, and her "badass moment" is now a meme. She randomly gave a speech to the Dothraki because the writers thought it'd look cool. Scenes like that with her offer nothing, and the aspect that everyone alive wants to bang her (semi-understandable. Attractive young woman, queen, dragons. Plenty of reasons to wanna be with her. Buttt), for no reason other than seemingly loving her instead of lusting after what she has, is silly.
She's a bland character who's easily out done by Brienne in all these traits and set goals. Brienne the Beauty, even if her recent actions don't make total sense, embodies those messages to a fuller extent that is significantly more pleasing to watch and indisputably a better character.
Tl
Viserys should've lived.
Stannis was the true king.
Brienne the beauty is awesome. Hands down. If Visery's lived instead of Dany, I'm pretty sure that's going to be the downfall of the Targs. unless they add the another Targ base from the book. He's like Joffrey but without the throne.
AND YEEEES... Stannis was the true king. Stupid fire lady.