Sorcery Capturing Cord

[Vanman]

I have a player who wants to take this artifact. He only has Terrestrial Circle Sorcery but he wants to buy the Sapphire level cord. My initial feeling is that, unless the character has the ability to actually cast the spell, he can't capture said spell. In my view, without the Essence that is used to craft and cast the spell, you don't have the knowledge necessary to deal with that particular level of sorcery, then you can't capture those spells, even if the artifact is of sufficient level. You simply don't have enough knowledge to be able to  fully utilize the cord.


Am I being too tough with this ruling?


Cheers,


V

 

[Flagg]

I'd say anyone can use one of those cords -- but they'd be completely dependent on a Celestial sorceror to do anything with it.


-S

 

[Vanman]

I'd say anyone can use one of those cords -- but they'd be completely dependent on a Celestial sorceror to do anything with it.
-S

So then they can catch Celestial spells but not release them. Makes sense. Thanks.


Cheers,


V

 

[Flagg]

So then they can catch Celestial spells but not release them. Makes sense. Thanks.

I guess they could release them, but without being able to control the magic, it would have the same effect as a botched Sapphire Circle spell (i.e. BOOM!)


-S

 

[Vanman]

I guess they could release them, but without being able to control the magic, it would have the same effect as a botched Sapphire Circle spell (i.e. BOOM!)
-S

Okay, then here's a question - how would they recognize a Celestial level spell? Would you say that all sorcerers know that the longer casting times equate to higher level spells? Or maybe by recognizing anima banners? Maybe an INT+Occult roll to determine this? Or is it hit or miss? A case of step in front of the spell and hope?


This was my initial justification for a character needing the appropriate level of sorcery in order to catch it. Otherwise, he doesn't know what to use. Or if he can handle it.

 

[Flagg]

I think it's reasonable that any Celestial-level sorceror could recognize Sapphire magic without a roll. For Terrestrial sorcerors and mortals, I think Int+Occult is appropriate.


-S

 

[Vanman]

I think it's reasonable that any Celestial-level sorceror could recognize Sapphire magic without a roll. For Terrestrial sorcerors and mortals, I think Int+Occult is appropriate.
-S

Would you make the INt+Occult roll reflexive?

 

[Flagg]

Would you make the INt+Occult roll reflexive?

I would, yes.


-S

 

[Silence In Daylight]

Has anyone noticed that the Cord doesn't have a stated use-time?


 I mean, does anything in the artifact description state that the stored spell takes as long to resolve as casting the spell normally? I argued that it should occur at the init tick of the character using the cord, and my ST didn't (or couldn't) disagree.

 

[Vanman]

Has anyone noticed that the Cord doesn't have a stated use-time?
 I mean, does anything in the artifact description state that the stored spell takes as long to resolve as casting the spell normally? I argued that it should occur at the init tick of the character using the cord, and my ST didn't (or couldn't) disagree.

No, it doesn't, actually. And I would think that it wouldn't. The time it takes to cast a spell is used to shape the Essence into the form of the spell. A spell that's been caught has already had that done. It's not like you're casting the spell again. You're just releasing a spell that's already been captured. So doing it on the initiative of the character using the cord seems like perfect sense to me.

 

[Silence In Daylight]

Sounds like a great idea, indeed...except that it makes the spell effectively uncounterable, unless someone holds action for countermagic.


 My ST did not have a fun time with that--the Twilight made a set of Necromancy-capturing bells for my Dawn necromancer. Near-uncounterable Shattered Void Mirrors...yum!

 

[Vanman]

Sounds like a great idea, indeed...except that it makes the spell effectively uncounterable, unless someone holds action for countermagic.
 My ST did not have a fun time with that--the Twilight made a set of Necromancy-capturing bells for my Dawn necromancer. Near-uncounterable Shattered Void Mirrors...yum!

Hadn't thought of that. Good point. Well, then, you could say that it takes the requisite amount of time for the Essence to untangle itself from the knot or be released or what have you. Just because the knot is untied doesn't necessarily mean that the spell will be released automatically. There is, after all, a huge amount of Essence captured within the cord. It could take some time getting out. I think this may have been left vague so that individual STs can decide for themselves. I don't think it would be too difficult to come up with a reason as to why it may take a turn or two before the spell is released.....

 

[Flagg]

You could also say that the more complex the spell, the more complex the knot required to capture it. A really complicated knot could take a few turns to untie.


-S

 

[Samiel]

Looking at the cord, it implies that you can capture the magic regardless of your personal power. You don't have to be a sorceror.


Likewise, once you untie the knot, the spell goes off just as the original sorceror wanted, but the user now directs where or at whom it strikes.


That's great, but not infallible. If the sorceror cast summon demon into the thing, then the untie-er of the knot would note a general darkening of the room, a sulphurous odour, and glowing circles and sigils appearing on the walls. Crazy reflections and phantasms dart across reflective surfaces.


Suddenly, the spell "Summon Demon" goes off, with only the 15 motes spent to cast it. It's cast from the ropes without extra essence to weaken the demon, so the unfortunate person to untie the knot must make a straight essence+willpower check against the demon to try and bind him. And bless the witless fool should he lose and the demon escape.


It serves as a great way to stop spells, but not knowing what the spell cast was, you can get yourself in trouble. You captured a spell from a sorceror, thinking it to be flying guillotine. When your sworn brotherhood are watching, dismayed, as the anathema gets away on horseback, you untie the knot (which would impose an initiative penalty, I'd say), only to cast death of obsidian butterflies on your luck-challenged friends.


It's a very powerful artifact in its own way; allowing the capture and re-casting of spells you don't necessarily need to know. But, if you can't garauntee foreknowledge of the spell in question before re-casting, you're in trouble.

 

[Silence In Daylight]

It serves as a great way to stop spells, but not knowing what the spell cast was, you can get yourself in trouble. You captured a spell from a sorceror, thinking it to be flying guillotine. When your sworn brotherhood are watching, dismayed, as the anathema gets away on horseback, you untie the knot (which would impose an initiative penalty, I'd say), only to cast death of obsidian butterflies on your luck-challenged friends.

 That may well be true for a newly acquired cord with spells already in it (characters are free to try a Perception + Occult roll at a very high diff to try and guess the spell from the knot), but the description of the capturing action has the cord wielder holding out the cord in the path of the coming spell. There's nothing to suggest that the spell does not manifest as usual before being sucked into the cord.


 Now, spells like Threefold Binding of the Heart may not have any significant physical features, but Butterflies or Flying Guillotine certainly does.