RP Feedback

[revo]

Hey guys. I run a RP called Evolution (see sig) and I just migrated all the posts from RPN over here. We had the group system crash over there so we had to cut and paste and generally reconfigure everything to fit this system. We have about 8-11 members who are still in the process of coming over here and getting their character sheets up.


I come from a predominantly play by post background. Most of the sites I've been on or run previous;y are one world on one forum (invisionsfree or jcink) and they've employed a lot of the organization techniques you see in my RPs. I'm HIGHLY focused on writing quality and plot development. The way I run my RPs is that I world build and then let the members collaborate and drive the plot. Sometimes I'll create NPCs or take leadership roles to drive the plot and keep things moving but where the RP goes is generally up to everyone. Over time we flesh out details as a group and create more explanation threads about specific factions and lore that arises. It's a very open, team oriented system.


The reason I post here is because I'd like some feedback. The way I am used to RPing seems very different from the way you guys operate (at least from what I can tell browsing). I noticed these differences when joining RPN/RPZ but I came anyways because I like the idea of being somewhere I can RP anything I want, any time I want without needing to find a new site. It's all right here.


So yea, do you think my way works? Do you think members here can understand it and/or will like it? Just some general commentary / critique would be great! Thanks. Link to RP in my sig.

 

[Grey]

That seems pretty standard approach to PbP Freeform, to me, so I expect people will get on-board easily enough. I mean, if it's been working for you thus far, safe to say it works, aye?


It's been tried here a few times, from what I recall, but those games burnt out before long. I've been... well, not running, but supervising something similar and it seems to have ground to a halt.

 

[Bardiel]

The design of this site seems suited to the idea of a world building and collaborate project/game. Are details discussed and hashed out by everyone prior to their addition to the canon lore/plot? It sounds quite interesting.

 

[revo]

@Grey - Thanks for the feedback. Great to know. Yes, it works for me but... it's very dependent on your audience and having people who want to create with you. I sure hope I can implement it in a way where it won't run itself into the ground! I think the key is being able to move on when character tie up the threads and keeping things moving. Guess we'll see.


@Bardiel - Thanks for your post! Glad you think it will work.


Well details seem to mainly be developed in the character sheets. I approve all of them before the members can post and make sure nothing contradicts the world but otherwise let people create. For example, we just had someone join us who created a "government" character and he's our first one. He created a unit called "Sector Ten" which his character belongs to which will likely become a permanent part of the world. When he sent me his character sheet he noted that he took creative liberties as I hadn't hashed out a lot of details for the government faction. He also referenced a "Bloody Winter" riot event that took place in NYC which will likely become part of the lore.


Another way we collaborate is through the use of "plot pages." Basically you post your character up and say what kind of plots and relationships you want to have for them. Then people can post ideas on how your characters can interact in game, what kind of threads and plots you can have, etc. So that's how a lot of our side plots develop. And as creator I can read the side-plots and get ideas on where I want our main threads to go and incorporate things from their side threads in the main ones to create a cohesive story line.


We also have OOC threads where people can brainstorm on ideas for main threads and what should happen next. It's also generally understood that you should ask me if you want to implement something really new and shocking to the game... just as a courtesy... At least I believe that's relatively known. Haha. If it's something I think will effect everyone I'll post up the idea and see what everyone thinks. All depends on the impact it will have on 1) the overall plot and 2) the players.


Does that explain it? Any other ways you'd suggest encouraging collaboration?

 

[Action Replay]

Let me start by saying welcome to the forums and make yourself at home, Revo.

I'm HIGHLY focused on writing quality and plot development.

I noticed after briefly going over your rp pitch that is indeed the case. Good work, it's an interesting read and certainly above my own level of writing. Is there a standard level of writing you look for in your potential players, or expect from them? Or is anyone welcome to join so as to improve their level of writing and enjoy the pbp experience?

The way I run my RPs is that I world build and then let the members collaborate and drive the plot. Sometimes I'll create NPCs or take leadership roles to drive the plot and keep things moving but where the RP goes is generally up to everyone. Over time we flesh out details as a group and create more explanation threads about specific factions and lore that arises. It's a very open, team oriented system.

That's generally what we have here from what I've seen so far. Fairly new myself but you get people here who run games like that or at least have many overlapping elements.

The reason I post here is because I'd like some feedback. The way I am used to RPing seems very different from the way you guys operate (at least from what I can tell browsing). I noticed these differences when joining RPN/RPZ but I came anyways because I like the idea of being somewhere I can RP anything I want, any time I want without needing to find a new site. It's all right here.


So yea, do you think my way works? Do you think members here can understand it and/or will like it? Just some general commentary / critique would be great! Thanks. Link to RP in my sig.

Thanks for the kind words about the site, although that's more of the admin's lines than mine. I think people here will understand, although it's a bit more laid back at rpzone in so far as word count goes. Out of curiosity could you point out some of those differences you mentioned seeing? That might help in understanding and offering potential suggestions.

 

[hellrazoromega]

I don't think some here would have an issue with that style. In my experience here, which I'll admit is only a few months, I have found lots of laid back people. But I suppose it is fair to say that some here are not used to being required to make a minimum word count on every post. While it is your game and you are free to do what you chose some, myself included, don't feel that quantity and quality necessarily go hand in hand. I know some sites do it that way but I have seen some very powerful posts that have been but a few words, in fact if such were not true then people would not have quotes in their sigs. Sometimes a wall of text is can weave a great story and other times it will be skimmed a superfluous, whether or not it truly is. Some will see thread minimums as restrictive, but I think you'll find plenty of people here who post that amount on average so I am sure you'll attract more members. I recently went back to school to get a more advanced degree and as a Historian I do tons of writing so while I wish you all the luck and the setting seems otherwise very inserting I'll pass based on the thread minimum, I get enough assignments where I need to meet and word or thread minimum and don't want another :tongue:. In any case, best wishes and welcome to the site. I hope you have fun here, I know I have.

 

[revo]

@Action Replay[/URL] - Thank you so much for the welcome! Your comments were helpful. There is no standard writing level, no. I guess if I had to sum it up I expect:

1. Minimal spelling and grammatical errors that inhibit read-ability. If I can't read your post, I can't draft a good reply. Errors that don't impact my understanding of your post are fine. We're human, it happens.
   
2. Writing that reflects a solid knowledge of the game world. I've had issues with people posting and contradicting the plot or posting and showing that they obviously have not read the posts before theirs.
   
3. Developing characters that are well rounded. No might and powerful gods with no weaknesses. No orphans who had their whole family killed off and have lived in a gutter with no hope every. No what we call "Mary Sue and Gary Stues." Multi-dimensional is the key.
   
4. Writing that uses a variety of language is especially nice. No "he said" over and over. No using the same action words over and over. So on and so forth. (this one's really a bonus)
   

My writing level is in no way an expectation. I don't need members to be at my level (I'm not all that advanced anyways...). I just want people to come into the RP with the idea that we are writing a story. To me, this means good writing and character development should be a priority.


Differences? Well...

1. The dice roleplays are WAY more prominent that PbP. I only see 8 non-dice RPs in the list. They just don't seem to be very popular so I worry mine won't be well received.
   
2. No one else seems to use plot pages like I do.
   
3. Some of the worlds are less developed than I'm used to. The resources system seems to help develop worlds but I have no idea how it works.
   
4. Heavy focus on high fantasy
   
5. Few people chose to moderate their RPs. In contrast, that's what I always do.
   

Hope that helps explain things! Thanks for the advice!!

I don't think some here would have an issue with that style. In my experience here, which I'll admit is only a few months, I have found lots of laid back people. But I suppose it is fair to say that some here are not used to being required to make a minimum word count on every post. While it is your game and you are free to do what you chose some, myself included, don't feel that quantity and quality necessarily go hand in hand. I know some sites do it that way but I have seen some very powerful posts that have been but a few words, in fact if such were not true then people would not have quotes in their sigs. Sometimes a wall of text is can weave a great story and other times it will be skimmed a superfluous, whether or not it truly is. Some will see thread minimums as restrictive, but I think you'll find plenty of people here who post that amount on average so I am sure you'll attract more members. I recently went back to school to get a more advanced degree and as a Historian I do tons of writing so while I wish you all the luck and the setting seems otherwise very inserting I'll pass based on the thread minimum, I get enough assignments where I need to meet and word or thread minimum and don't want another :tongue:. In any case, best wishes and welcome to the site. I hope you have fun here, I know I have.

@hellrazoromega - I get where you're coming from 100%. In the PbP communities I'm used to there's a constant debate on if you should employ word count minimums. I've thought about it and generally implement it. When I first came to RPN I noticed a lot of 1-3 liners in the RPs and I was instantly turned off by them. For me, that's simply not enough for me to reply to. I'm not saying that more words means you have more quality. I'm saying in most cases, it doesn't help your partners out enough. That's why I do it. Not to be restrictive. Honestly, if someone threw a really quality post in the mix that's below word count I wouldn't even notice. I don't count. I just put it there as a way of saying "in this RP we care about writing quality." I know # of words and caring about writing quality doesn't always go hand in hand... but it sets a tone I think. That's all I'm trying to convey... and I don't think saying "quality writing required" will do any good. But then again... maybe it would?


I'm open to thinking more about this if people think the word count will cripple the RP. Thanks for the feedback =)

 

[Action Replay]

@Action Replay - Thank you so much for the welcome! Your comments were helpful. There is no standard writing level, no. I guess if I had to sum it up I expect:

1. Minimal spelling and grammatical errors that inhibit read-ability. If I can't read your post, I can't draft a good reply. Errors that don't impact my understanding of your post are fine. We're human, it happens.
   
2. Writing that reflects a solid knowledge of the game world. I've had issues with people posting and contradicting the plot or posting and showing that they obviously have not read the posts before theirs.
   
3. Developing characters that are well rounded. No might and powerful gods with no weaknesses. No orphans who had their whole family killed off and have lived in a gutter with no hope every. No what we call "Mary Sue and Gary Stues." Multi-dimensional is the key.
   
4. Writing that uses a variety of language is especially nice. No "he said" over and over. No using the same action words over and over. So on and so forth. (this one's really a bonus)
   

My writing level is in no way an expectation. I don't need members to be at my level (I'm not all that advanced anyways...). I just want people to come into the RP with the idea that we are writing a story. To me, this means good writing and character development should be a priority.


Differences? Well...

1. The dice roleplays are WAY more prominent that PbP. I only see 8 non-dice RPs in the list. They just don't seem to be very popular so I worry mine won't be well received.
   
2. No one else seems to use plot pages like I do.
   
3. Some of the worlds are less developed than I'm used to. The resources system seems to help develop worlds but I have no idea how it works.
   
4. Heavy focus on high fantasy
   
5. Few people chose to moderate their RPs. In contrast, that's what I always do.
   

Hope that helps explain things! Thanks for the advice!!

You're very welcome. I'm glad if it was helpful to you even slightly. The first set of points you posted are more than fair, and generally what you'll find going around here. Admittedly, I am guilty of falling into #4 subconsciously, although not quite using he/she said this or that. Takes a lot of work to break that habit and remains very much a work in progress for me as a writer.


1. On differences that can be attributed to the site's history. Old timers, feel free to jump in and correct this whippersnapper if I get it wrong aye? It started out as Pattern Spider which primarily was about a tabletop rpg. Namely Exalted. It merged together with another rp site called Wayward Inn. (Where does this sound familiar...? ). So tabletops are insanely popular here as we are all nerds who love tabletops. Hence the discrepancy between word and dice.


2. Some do...just not always as you do. I am in two such games where they were thrown about as either rumors around town or different regions of the world containing a plot. This feels more along the lines of ST preference in style to me. Some just want you to find out as they tell the story and put out the overarching plot hook in their looking for players pitch. YMMV. Point is don't let something like plot pages get to you. Chances of people reacting negatively to such a thing are slim.


3. What sort of level are you accustomed to? As said in #1, most are familiar with tabletops and tend to cleave to it in their style more often than not. Those generally speaking lay out a world for you so there is "less" ST detail in the dice RPs (with exceptions; see apocalypse world) as reading the pdf will provide you with what you need. Y'know, because you aren't making this all up from scratch now. People tend to expect you've read them already so they just throw in their own twists or flesh out certain areas of that setting.


4. I reiterate, we are all nerds who love tabletops. (Disclaimer, sweeping generalizations ho!). Is this a deal breaker or just a brave new world you're unaccustomed to?


5. This one just outright confuses me, given that is what my STs tend to do. We may just have different definitions of the word. Won't be the first time that's happened to me. One thing is the forums barring a very recent change had a set up where you had to get a staff member to approve the RP pitch to create the forum. The system is now in a hands off mode that lets people take a more hands on approach with their own games. If that seems rampant this may be the cause.


On the post count, I'd be interested in trying your pbp but with all the games I'm in on this and other sites at present....it's a very leery proposition to jump into anything with a word count limit and expect a consistent output with any regularity. Especially given a very hectic RL. In past experience sites that demand a set word count put me in a mind set that I'm being forced to write and that is not why you join up for these things. The general idea is to have fun and not feel forced into doing it, no? Might just be me here.


My suggestion is to "try" striking a balance. Just to say you don't expect walls of text but you wish to see more than beggar posts. So long as the message is conveyed and it contributes to the story everything is peachy. What say you Revo?

 

[revo]

@Action Replay


As for #5 it doesn't matter anymore. I meant "moderate" as in the RP prefixes, "open," "closed," and "moderated." I had us at moderated and was having people apply to join via PM. Then I realized people who just joined can't PM so I made it "open" and stated that our character sheets need creator approval before you can post.


The prevalence of dice rps is in no way a deal breaker! I think it's great! NERDS UNITE! I just wanted to make sure there's an interest in PbP (high fantasy and not) so I'm not doing all this world building to fall flat on my face? You know? haha.


I think you may have a point. I've changed our rules to say:

1. Our goal here is high quality writing. Therefore, a writing sample is required in your character sheet. We also generally want to see around 300 words a post. This is not because we think in terms of quantity over quality. We simply want to make sure the posters after you have enough to reply to. Please keep this in mind.
   

 

[Grey]

I'd be put off by a word count, but that's just because I have a preference for brevity in all my writing.


While we don't have a lot of diceless games now, we used to have a crazy high number. I think you'll attract an audience, and if you already have players, so much the better.


The fantasy bias is a bit weird, but it's changing - I've got three modern games on the burn, and a sort-of cyberpunk dystopia game. I know a couple of post-apocs started recently, too.


I'll probably try to tempt you into a dice game at some point - it's probably a rite of passage for new players now that I try to seduce them into a game. I'd have a possibly perfect one now, but I've had to put my potential players in a pit and make them knife-fight for slots in that one.


I hope we see you in the Creativity forum, too, since you take writing so seriously. Feedback is hard to come by.

 

[revo]

Haha you're welcome to tempt me.


I'd like to post in Creativity but it wasn't super clear you can give critique or feedback. I guess I'll have to look at it more closely. =)

 

[Grey]

There's a thread requesting feedback, with links to the requested content. You don't get a lot of it too - it usually varies between too polite to be useful, or just not useful.

 

[hellrazoromega]

@Action Replay - Thank you so much for the welcome! Your comments were helpful. There is no standard writing level, no. I guess if I had to sum it up I expect:

1. Minimal spelling and grammatical errors that inhibit read-ability. If I can't read your post, I can't draft a good reply. Errors that don't impact my understanding of your post are fine. We're human, it happens.
   
2. Writing that reflects a solid knowledge of the game world. I've had issues with people posting and contradicting the plot or posting and showing that they obviously have not read the posts before theirs.
   
3. Developing characters that are well rounded. No might and powerful gods with no weaknesses. No orphans who had their whole family killed off and have lived in a gutter with no hope every. No what we call "Mary Sue and Gary Stues." Multi-dimensional is the key.
   
4. Writing that uses a variety of language is especially nice. No "he said" over and over. No using the same action words over and over. So on and so forth. (this one's really a bonus)
   

My writing level is in no way an expectation. I don't need members to be at my level (I'm not all that advanced anyways...). I just want people to come into the RP with the idea that we are writing a story. To me, this means good writing and character development should be a priority.


Differences? Well...

1. The dice roleplays are WAY more prominent that PbP. I only see 8 non-dice RPs in the list. They just don't seem to be very popular so I worry mine won't be well received.
   
2. No one else seems to use plot pages like I do.
   
3. Some of the worlds are less developed than I'm used to. The resources system seems to help develop worlds but I have no idea how it works.
   
4. Heavy focus on high fantasy
   
5. Few people chose to moderate their RPs. In contrast, that's what I always do.
   

Hope that helps explain things! Thanks for the advice!!


@hellrazoromega - I get where you're coming from 100%. In the PbP communities I'm used to there's a constant debate on if you should employ word count minimums. I've thought about it and generally implement it. When I first came to RPN I noticed a lot of 1-3 liners in the RPs and I was instantly turned off by them. For me, that's simply not enough for me to reply to. I'm not saying that more words means you have more quality. I'm saying in most cases, it doesn't help your partners out enough. That's why I do it. Not to be restrictive. Honestly, if someone threw a really quality post in the mix that's below word count I wouldn't even notice. I don't count. I just put it there as a way of saying "in this RP we care about writing quality." I know # of words and caring about writing quality doesn't always go hand in hand... but it sets a tone I think. That's all I'm trying to convey... and I don't think saying "quality writing required" will do any good. But then again... maybe it would?


I'm open to thinking more about this if people think the word count will cripple the RP. Thanks for the feedback =)

Oh I did not mean to imply that you put the minimum there to be restrictive I was just pointing out that some might see it as such with out being used to that style. I like Grey tend to be brief depending on the character I am Rping--I have a few who can be quite loquacious.


Now the other rules--while I understand the need to have understandable communication, I guess I have been on enough boards with non-native Enlish speakers that it does not bother me the way it does some if the English is a bit sub-standard. I get that you are not being draconian or anything but rules like that #4 remind me of writing a paper, it is a standard requirement of any well written academic paper. But my formal/academic English and my colloquial English are two different animals, I RP to relax after writing some 12,000 word beast on Eleanor of Aquitaine, so I freely admit that sometimes my grammar and what not suffers. First, because my brain is cooked and second because I have returned to school 25 years after working in various fields that required little to no typing so I have the typing skills of a blind monkey, who has had too much Red Bull, and is getting electric shocks during a 9.0 earthquake. So what I am getting at is that I would recommend that you make it clear that the above are just guidelines and not chiseled in stone rules. You seem reasonable enough so I am sure that is what you would do anyway I am just suggesting that you make sure you are clear for those that don't know you or your style. Even when a disclaimer is included and when things are lined out as numbered or bulleted items many people tend to take them as hard rules rather than guidelines.


Not that any of this is to discourage you, just pointing out a few things, I am sure you'll be fine because the game does sound very interesting. Anyway that is my free advice--as always, worth exactly what you paid for it. :tongue:


So I will leave you with a quote from a fellow Gamer and student of the English language:


The problem with defending the purity of the English language is that English is about as pure as a cribhouse whore. We don't just borrow words; on occasion, English has pursued other languages down alleyways to beat them unconscious and riffle their pockets for new vocabulary.---James Nicoll