I've decided I hate Beam Klaves

J

Joseph

Member
I tried really hard to like these things.  I don't think they're necessarily out of genre in Autochthonia, I don't have a problem with them being essentially identical to Star Wars lightsabers, and I think they're fairly balanced (and, if anything, slightly weak) for their Artifact rating.


None the less, I just can't envision an Exalt using one; there's just something about them that doesn't quite fit the image.  Alchemical Exalted should use traditional Exalt weapons that are modified in cool mechanical ways, not lightsabers.  This creates a cooler image in mind of them wielding it, while at the same time making the weapons used by them even more varied and unique, instead of mass produced lightsabers.
 
I had quite the opposite reaction. My immediate knee-jerk response was "what the fuck is this shit?"


However, the more I think about it, the less I dislike them. I do agree, though, that Autocthonia, as a setting, is probably better off without them.


-S
 
Yeah. I'd always envisioned the Autochonians using hugely modified Magitech artifacts, thanks to the vision Joseph gave me of Autochonia in his game. While they do seem "cool," I'd really rather use a normal, albeit modified, daiklave.
 
Hell, even a chainsword (as dumb as those are) would be more fitting.


-S
 
They're very popular with the Warhammer 40k crew.


Technical issues aside (and no, I'm not saying chainswords are a fabulous idea), if someone came at me with a chainsword I'd think twice about blocking. :-)
 
An example modified Grand Daiklaive I made using the more mechanical ideas I was referring to:


-Moonsilver Grand Daiklaive - End of Blasphemy (Artifact ****)


Spd +10, Acc +4, Dmg +12L, Def -1, Rt 3, Cmt 8 motes


-Powers:


1) Momentum Generation: Hundreds of tiny gyroscopes in the blade massively increase its momentum when swung.  Parry successes are halved (rounded up) when defending against its attacks, as the blade ploughs right through the defense. Attacks that are successfully dodged are likely to cause collateral damage to ground and/or walls near the individual swung at.  


2) Inspire Terror: Producing and emitting a faint Essence-derived pheremone whose manufacture was taught by a defender Custodian in the Deep Reaches, End of Blasphemy has a strong effect on those who would do harm to the Machine God or His loyal inhabitants.  Enemies of the Great Maker -- including, but not limited to, servants of the Void -- are stricken with panic at the sight of the wielder of End of Blasphemy, even if they normally lack the capacity for fear.  Subtract 2 dice from all their dice pools while in his presence.
 
Relic said:
Technical issues aside (and no, I'm not saying chainswords are a fabulous idea), if someone came at me with a chainsword I'd think twice about blocking. :-)
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They could accomplish almost anything that a beam klave can (cut through weapons, armor, etc) and should still need a Scene-long Essence commitment to power them. They just wouldn't be as portable.


-S
 
Stillborn said:
Hell, even a chainsword (as dumb as those are) would be more fitting.
-S
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What the hell is a chainsword?
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Chainswords are cool when it's you verses the forces of Chaos. And all good Space Marines know, no evil, be they mutants, heretics, ungodly xenos, or chaos spawn, can withstand vigorous smacking of a chainsword.
 
I'll have to agree with Joseph here. Light sabers are just too star-warsy, not exalted. When I think of Autochthonia, I think of lots of oil, assembly lines, cramped and hazardous work spaces, steel vats, rust, steam. In other words: industrial, cyber-punk, sci-fantasy.
 
If the Alchemicals were even more like machines, and less like cyborgs, I could handle the beam klaives better.


I'd like chainsaws better, too. The big fucking giant ones Juicers used in the RIFTS supplement about a Juicer uprising.
 
I wouldn't mind Alchemicals fighting with something that very much resembled a chainsaw. Chainswords however, are, and always will be, retarded.


-S
 
Vibroblades are entirely different than chainswords. The former is slightly less retarded, but stil kinda stupid.


There has to come a point where if you can do crazy feats of technological death-dealing, you don't need a blade of any kind anymore. Your technology would most likely be better served in a different form of weapon.


Take the historical "gun swords" for example. The idea never really took hold, because if you have a gun, about the worst way you can fuck it up is to glue a sword to it. It works MUCH better by itself.


However, dorks like swords, so sci-fi writers try to re-fit swords with all sorts of ridiculous shit, like bladed chains, high-intensity energy beams, etc.


Lame.


-S
 
To be honest, I think all weapons HAVE to be taken into their proper context, be they 'laser-swords' (yes, they were called that in the star wars movie novelizations), to vibro-blades to death ray cannons (which when you think about it, really applies to all energy beam weaponary).


If it makes sense, I'm all for it. which means that I wouldn't object to seeing Beam-Klaves in Autochtonia, but they'd be dangerous weapons in certain areas, liable to ignite stuff you don't want ignited.


Chainswords? Keen, I can see a Shogunate weapon that is a massive daiklave with spiffy chainsaw teeth action, up-keep is a fucking bitch thou.  Also, don't bother with stealth if it's running.


Want a blaster? Go for it, upkeep as well as their ammo's fucking rarity will keep your life interesting, you get to go - dare I shoot? What if I miss?


Yeah... good times alround. On the other hand, I would have a slight problem with large powerbows in Autochtonia, again... context in much the manner a beam-klave would need to be explained for if your character is an exalt in Creation.
 
Stillborn said:
Vibroblades are entirely different than chainswords. The former is slightly less retarded, but stil kinda stupid.
(snip)


-S
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There are examples of weapons with additional blade bits already, the Lightning Chain from CB:D and Swordstick (or may have been a club, I distinctly remember red essence 'spikes' though) from RoR. Both of these use essence to generate their spiky bits (even though they are static and don't move), so rather than having a mechanical chainsaw section on a daiklaive, the user could keep pumping essence in to the blade each turn in order to get the essence spikes to rotate around the blade, giving the desired effect.
 
Hi everybody, I'm Cyl French GM, I must admit I haven't read Autochtonians yet, but on a french forum, I heard of beam klaives, and every single GM seems to have the same problem with this stuff... a bit too star wars-like...


But I don't see them as msiplaced in the EXALTED universe... I've always related the game with most of the heroic fantasy animes ans mangas, and with many of the great RPGs of the mid 90's, and in those kind of environment, you have energy blades, or light blades or whatever you name it.


I think of the Phantasy Star series (okay a bit too technological to fit in EXALTED, I give you that), or the Shining Force series, or Final Fantasy... there are quite awesome light blades or energy blades in those games, and they don't fuck up the game just because they're from another level of technology...


I've not managed to read a description of it yet... but I can imagine it easily as a daiklave with a techo-magical mechanism on the blade that generates an essence-made edge... so the blade is not entirely made from essence like a lightsaber, but only the edge, that makes the weapon looks much more cool and nasty, and it won't be seen as directly inspired from star wars lightsabers, don't you think ?
 
cyl said:
I've not managed to read a description of it yet... but I can imagine it easily as a daiklave with a techo-magical mechanism on the blade that generates an essence-made edge... so the blade is not entirely made from essence like a lightsaber, but only the edge, that makes the weapon looks much more cool and nasty, and it won't be seen as directly inspired from star wars lightsabers, don't you think ?
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I think that sounds great. As in, very much not stupid.


-S
 
cyl said:
I've not managed to read a description of it yet... but I can imagine it easily as a daiklave with a techo-magical mechanism on the blade that generates an essence-made edge... so the blade is not entirely made from essence like a lightsaber, but only the edge, that makes the weapon looks much more cool and nasty, and it won't be seen as directly inspired from star wars lightsabers, don't you think ?
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That would be cool, but that's also not what Beam Klaves are described as.  They are written up to be JUST like lightsabers.  They are a handle, and when activated through spending Essence, they create a beam of essence much like a lightsaber blade.


So your idea is fine, but it's also not what Beam Klaves officially are, and thus makes them no more tolerable in my eyes.
 
heh what can I say... the first rule of a RPG like Exalted is "do what your instinct tells you, trust the force"... if you don't like the way the beam klaves are made... change it so it can fit in your general opinion... I know that my french collegues reacted pretty bad whith those ones... but they don't like the techno-magical trip of EXALTED at some point.


I think I'll just stick to my version of the Beam klave 'til I see one more attractive to me.


And I don't really feel bad when not following the official way... Exalted is too much based on the freedom of imagination of the GM to build a campaign and make the world evolve for I be stopped by a lightsabe-looking klave.


Though I find the idea of an essence edged blade very interesting to establish the large difference between Creation's technologicals toys of the First Age and Autochtonians powerful stuff.
 
cyl said:
I think I'll just stick to my version of the Beam klave 'til I see one more attractive to me.
And I don't really feel bad when not following the official way...
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I am not saying you SHOULD feel bad about not following the official way, I agree you are doing the right thing in revising to make it more acceptable to you.  


It simply has little bearing on the merits of ACTUAL Beam Klaves as they are written, which is what is being discussed.
 
Chain swords...


I would have preferred to see mono-molecular blades for the Alchemicals instead of beam klaives myself.


Then again, I used energy blades as an option for Solars in my Long Second Age setting.  


And Chain swords.


And mono-molecular blades as well.


It's up to you. You can excise them pretty easily.  I don't think beam klaives are in genre with the normal Exalted setting, per se, but IN Autochthonia, it isn't too bad.  Blatant rip off Star Wars, but even balanced out easily enough.


Then again, I'm the fella who put Gun Klaives into that same setting. It's all about the flavor. Some folks like the Space Opera feel of a beam blade--Lensmen too--and that's for them. Me, I don't think I'll be using them myself, or if I do, it will be as a much rarer Artifact.
 
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