How to be "better"

[Vudukudu]

In my.. however long its been on RpNation, I've seen a fair amount of talk about the differences between good and bad roleplayers. Typically stuff about Mary Sues and grammar and what all. It got me thinking "What if people just made a list of all the crap they hate seeing in character sheets and in general about roleplays?"


Keep in mind, this isn't so much about specifics. For example, saying you hate "Mass Effect fandom roleplays" because you don't like Mass Effect doesn't help anyone. The goal here is to be constructive, and I suppose a bit more objective. If you're going to delve into specifics, make it clear.


I.E. "In magical fantasy style roleplays, I dislike the stupid orc trope" helps a lot more than "I hate tropes" because nearly everything can be described as a trope and that particular piece of advice doesn't carry a whole lot of constructive weight.


All that said and done, feel free to post and explain things you wish you saw a whole lot less of on this site. Remember, this is a "guide" of sorts, so try to pose things in a way that could help people wanting advice on how to write higher quality roleplays and posts.

 

[Dr Nyx]

*Cracks every bone in body and obnoxiously clears throat for five minutes*


Well, Let me begin this epic Rant of history. If it helps, feel free to imagine me as an Old man screaming "YOU DAMN PUNKS" whilst shaking his fist and leaning on his walking stick.


Also this'll probably come off as incredibly blunt and a bit vulgar soo....Warning or whatever.


1) Grammar is somewhat essential and highly appreciated by all Rper's I believe, no matter the level that the Rp Set at. If you actually give the effort and try to have some decent grammatical skill, then you are appreciated for your effort If English or anything like that isn't your first language. If however you can spell amazing, yet don't even "try" with grammar then that's just really really..Lazy. Hell this post may have a few grammatical inaccuracies already but you can tell I'm actually trying. Those who simply "can't be asked" are somewhat pitiful and it says a lot about them as a Rper. I myself going a long way to avoid people who I see continuously using horrendous eye bleaching grammar. No one likes awful grammar and everyone will be thankful if you actually put the effort in; Good grammar also goes the extra mile and says how good of a writer you are obviously...also shows how much effort you typically put into things. Obviously Out of character or in Non-Serious situations, not using grammar is fine but when in the IC, Use it to your best ability.


You should also be open to improvement and not start getting annoyed if someone corrects you. Sure, Grammar Nazism isn't exactly fun but neither is looking at horrendous writing.


2) Special little snow flakes or stereotypical Emo's. There's a very fine line between making a good character and making a tragic backstory merely because it makes them special. Most of the time the people that do this don't even utilize the backstory properly and don't do the research associated with such things; Making them look hilariously stupid when people actually know what would happen. Now don't misunderstand, Tragic back stories can sometimes be incredibly captivating and well written, Sometimes even vital in making a character who they are. If you do plan on making a tragic backstory, Please do the research and all. Also ask yourself "Is including this event actually adding to my character, Or Am I trying to be a Special little snow flake?"


3) Super Stereotypes for absolutely no reason. Is having a super flamboyant, Gay guy realllllyyyyyy necessary?......Is having an overly "Ghetto" sassy black woman actually needed?.....No?...Then just don't do it. My advise on how to be better on including this?...Don't do it. Just..no.


4) Forced Romance. Now this one is probably the most common in every Rp site in history; especially in those typically cancerous School Rp's, Avid Anime Shippers & the sort. Romance is a special spark between two people that doesn't happen in five bloody minutes, in which they begin dragging each other to bed whilst giggling each other's names. If it happened like that, I would be surrounded by a Sea of Glorious Marble sculpted Ginger, Red head or Blonde haired men who fawned over me like Aphrodite. My advice is to make it seem genuine, Make sure the character have disagreements...Arguments and eventually fall in love and admit feelings over the course of the story...And I mean story, Not page. Also try planning things over a tiny bit instead, Work out how to possibly make sure that other players don't feel super third wheeled and all that. No one likes being forgotten because two players are screaming "SUGOI, SUGOI, SUGOI SHIP SHIP." in the OOC Whilst shipping there characters in the first Introduction post of the page.


5) Taking the IC To heart. Oh, Your character got insulted so your now planning a spiteful plan on how to kill their character suddenly and with no reason...Boohoo sweety. This thing probably makes me more angrier than bad grammar and forced Romance, I mean just why?...My advice for this to simply...Not take it to heart?..Unless the player is specifically making there character say "GO FUCK YOURSELF { INSERT USERNAME HERE }" Then they probably aren't trying to annoy you or insult you. Also hating a player because you hate there character is the saddest thing a human being can do and you should probably feel ashamed, Unless said character is a Godly Mary Sue. Then feel free to unleash the wrath of God upon them. Just simply try to be civil to each other and not acting like a Twelve Year old playing Call of duty. If you're against something, try to state it in a semi-polite way.


I'll probably post more later on, But the care home are giving out free Meds and Prune juice.


*Scoots away*

 

[Kylesar1]

Here is my opinion on a couple of different subjects. If you have a question or disagree, just tell me

Spoiler

Grammar and Punctuation- Grammar is by far the most basic requirement. I swear to God, if I'm hosting a RP and I get a post that looks like I'm reading a Spoderman meme, I'll boot them out in a second. I can be lenient, but this is one of my biggest pet peeves, and something of zero tolerance

This has never happened before, and I'm pretty sure it won't happen on a site like this. I understand that some people will mess up some spelling or some grammar, and that's alright. However, you should post somewhat like you've had some schooling. When writing, write like you're doing Creative Writing, a narrative or something. Write like you're writing a book





Special Snowflakes- I hate tragic for the sake of tragedy. The honorable Dr. Nyx said it perfectly. Not everyone has that super tragic backstory. Raped 5 times, lost everyone in their family, became a slave to an abusive high-class bastard, has 3 contradicting mental illnesses, blah blah blah. It's to the point where I stop doing tragic backstories just to get away from the crazy overused cliche. This problem could be attributed to the tragic backstory to every anime character ever......... or the crazy notion that everyone has to be a special snowflake





Romance- Romance can be a good thing in a RP............... I just haven't seen it pulled off well. Every romance I've seen is all this lovey-dovey mushy stuff that stagnates the entire RP and takes a lot of useless space. Like, I've seen 2 pages of nothing but 2 players in their Romantic world. I've been on the receiving end of a request that their character has a crush on mine. I accepted, but never expect me to do all this cuddling and kissing and stuff. I'm not the mushy type, and that shouldn't be what romance is all about





Concepts- There's nothing worse than a RP with a bad concept. It'll push away most of the best and dedicated RPers. The concept begins with the title. If the RP's title is bad, everything is bad. For example, If the title of the RP is "x RP," you can safely assume the RP isn't all that planned out. If you lack in the story department, it'd better be made up with good mechanics and a good world overall. Free Form RPs can be pulled off really well only if it has a good world and good mechanics





Fandoms- Fandoms must be backed up better than the average RP. Reason? It already has a story and mechanics and all that shit. Not only that, but everyone in the RP knows about said story and mechanics and all that shit. As the host, you must really know your stuff. You can't go in with half-assed knowledge and succeed. However, you can't be too rigid either, lest the RP become a dictatorship and people start quitting. As a player, you still have to know your stuff. This is especially important in Gaming Fandoms, which have highly complex mechanics





Rigidity and Fluidity- This is for the hosts or potential hosts. It describes how strict or how lenient you are, how strict/lenient the story is, the mechanics are, etc. It starts with the CS above all. If the CS is extremely long and takes a whole lot of effort to make, chances are, the story is more strict. If the CS has only a few entries, it's probably more lenient. That's not to say either side is bad, but either extreme is a huge turnoff. As a host, you must be find the perfect balance between fluid and rigid. Make the story solid, but not rigid. Make the mechanics solid, but forgiving. Make the story able to be influenced. Make the mechanics easy to follow and worth following. Don't be a dictator, but don't let players do just anything. Either extreme is a huge turn-off





Characters- Put some effort in your character. Every character draws inspiration from something, but don't be a complete rip-off. Creativity in a character is imperative. Your character will say a lot about you as a player........ as in, your ability to contribute to the story, influence it, and adapt to whatever happens. Make sure your character has some sort of limitation in mind. This is especially important in RPs with magic and powers. OP characters are not fun to play with. In my opinion, you should really avoid God Powers. God Powers are those that can't be avoided or countered. For example, Time or Space Magic is a God Power. Everything is influenced by time, and everything takes up space. It'll take a huge amount of limitations to not make it OP




Other Players- You must get along with other players. If you don't like another player in the RP, then tough shit if you want to stay in that RP. Don't take the IC dialog into the OOC. If a character doesn't like yours, don't take it personally. Just adapt and move on. Just like in real life, you can't please everybody, and you're always gonna have weaknesses. OOC arguments should be solved immediately. If you're a host, you should never get in an argument in the OOC. You're the host. You're the top dog. You have the right to boot unruly players out. Don't abuse that position of power, but make it clear that you won't take any bullshit from rude players

 

[Do You Know]

A good writer is someone who understands basic writing standards and uses this prior knowledge to establish their own style and feel.


A good roleplayer is someone who can characterize and mingle well with other writers, as well as build an overarching story effectively.


That's how I currently see it. You need to be a fair-enough writer to be a decent roleplayer.


That and you must post. If you're inactive and hold your fellow(s) back, you're a terrible roleplayer. I'm positive most roleplays die because of a "lack of motivation".

 

[determinator]

Read. Read more books. Please read more effing books.


Also write a lot, and understand that this is not the Olympics, although there is a certain decorum that needs to be followed in order to fare well with other people.


Practice.


And please for gods' sake don't think that genitalia holds you back from certain roles.


Those are my basic tips.

 

[Grey]

Read. Read more books. Please read more effing books.
.

This. This shit right here. I like you, kid.


Meanwhile, I hate it when people have clearly spent more time on their BBCode than the actual setting or plot. I am immediately, intensely suspicious of posters who persistently use an unusual choice of font.


But the two main ways to be better are read more, and write more.


As a writer, I don't look at roleplaying in the same light as a lot of people here, though. For me, it's a game. If I'm going to actually write I'll go and do that alone. Very different skillsets.

 

[Bone2pick]

As a writer, I don't look at roleplaying in the same light as a lot of people here, though. For me, it's a game. If I'm going to actually write I'll go and do that alone. Very different skillsets.

You've said this before, and I've always wanted to comment on it. Now's my chance. (8))


That certainly is an area where our approach to this hobby is very different. Not that it shouldn't be different, it just is. I view this (specifically forum roleplaing) as a group writing endevoure, or at the very least, group storytelling. It's narrative entertainment and exercise rather than a game. It's more theatre than chess if you get my drift.


You take your writing here seriously so it doesn't affect the quality of your posts, but it does tend to keep you in the dice section. So there's that consequence. And it keeps me out of dice as a result. Interesting, no?

 

[Sycophant]

As a writer, I don't look at roleplaying in the same light as a lot of people here, though. For me, it's a game. If I'm going to actually write I'll go and do that alone. Very different skillsets.

What are the different skill sets between writing a narrative and writing a contribution to a narrative?

 

[Grey]

You've said this before, and I've always wanted to comment on it. Now's my chance. (8))
That certainly is an area where our approach to this hobby is very different. Not that it shouldn't be different, it just is. I view this (specifically forum roleplaing) as a group writing endevoure, or at the very least, group storytelling. It's narrative entertainment and exercise rather than a game. It's more theatre than chess if you get my drift.


You take your writing here seriously so it doesn't affect the quality of your posts, but it does tend to keep you in the dice section. So there's that consequence. And it keeps me out of dice as a result. Interesting, no?

It is interesting. Although I see no reason to divorce game and narrative, pers'nally. There's still a story to it, just a different mechanism for constructing it.

What are the different skill sets between writing a narrative and writing a contribution to a narrative?

Writing a narrative alone requires the focus and discipline to do the whole thing alone. It requires you to construct and track an entire plot, the characters, and the setting. It requires you to write in a way that is comfortable and pleasing to read unless you're doing something experimental (actively hostile to the reader, deep-immersion style, found document format...), and normally demands that you keep your audience in mind.


When it comes to roleplaying, in the manner I and my friends do it, there are two skill sets.


For the GM, you need to be an efficient communicator, you need to be able to keep track of multiple plotlines, and you need to set the scene while remaining relatively behind the curtain, and you need to drip-feed the plot to people without just telling them outright what is happening. As a player, you need to be able to step into the mindset of your character and from that perspective pursue their agenda, follow the clues the GM has laid out for you, add texture to the world and scenes, and really carry the narrative that's being offered. It doesn't, however, prevent anyone who lacks for writing ability being involved.


If you're treating the exercise as collaborative writing, you need excellent communication skills, improvisational skills, and some actual writing ability. Although at that point I really doubt the viability of the whole affair beyond a bit of practice, unless you have a great working relationship with your fellow player/s. I get more writing done without someone interfering.


There's definitely some overlap between the skillsets, but I think they're ultimately pretty distinct. Some of my favourite roleplayers can't write for shit.


Interesting thing: I know, personally, a couple dozen roleplayers, and I'm in a community with somewhere over one hundred roleplayers. Maybe 1% of them consider themselves writers, the rest just like to roleplay, and they tend to view the two separately.

 

[Bone2pick]

Interesting thing: I know, personally, a couple dozen roleplayers, and I'm in a community with somewhere over one hundred roleplayers. Maybe 1% of them consider themselves writers, the rest just like to roleplay, and they tend to view the two separately.

I assume you're talking about kitchen table RPGs? If so, I would agree with you—few table players consider themselves writers. I cut my RP teeth on AD&D, Shadowrun, Champions, Gamma World, ect. But that's exactly why I prefer forum RPs over pen and paper. You ever heard of the concept of a comedian's comedian ? A guy whose humor caters to other comics but not necessarily a mainstream audience? That's how I view detailed forum RPing, it's a storyteller's medium.


Forget stats, dice, experience, random encounters, and hit points, Just tell me a story. Make a character, spin an adventure, and make me care. And reading and writing always makes me care more. It's always more immersive.

 

[Grey]

I always view that as the answer of someone who has had poor GMs - I see no reason you can't have both, you know?


Likewise, I don't see it as a storytellers medium. Storytelling is a storytellers medium. I'd rather read a novel than someone's half-finished, half-baked RP or shackle myself to a project that won't do anything but waste energy and ideas.


But you and I can argue this in circles for years. Different worlds, man. I'm not about to suggest either is better.

 

[Bone2pick]

I always view that as the answer of someone who has had poor GMs - I see no reason you can't have both, you know?

I've had poor, mediocre, and strong & passionate GMs. I've had all kinds. And no I don't know what you mean by both. But I agree it's pointless to argue that either is better.

 

[Sycophant]

Writing a narrative alone requires the focus and discipline to do the whole thing alone. It requires you to construct and track an entire plot, the characters, and the setting. It requires you to write in a way that is comfortable and pleasing to read unless you're doing something experimental (actively hostile to the reader, deep-immersion style, found document format...), and normally demands that you keep your audience in mind.
When it comes to roleplaying, in the manner I and my friends do it, there are two skill sets.


For the GM, you need to be an efficient communicator, you need to be able to keep track of multiple plotlines, and you need to set the scene while remaining relatively behind the curtain, and you need to drip-feed the plot to people without just telling them outright what is happening. As a player, you need to be able to step into the mindset of your character and from that perspective pursue their agenda, follow the clues the GM has laid out for you, add texture to the world and scenes, and really carry the narrative that's being offered. It doesn't, however, prevent anyone who lacks for writing ability being involved.


If you're treating the exercise as collaborative writing, you need excellent communication skills, improvisational skills, and some actual writing ability. Although at that point I really doubt the viability of the whole affair beyond a bit of practice, unless you have a great working relationship with your fellow player/s. I get more writing done without someone interfering.


There's definitely some overlap between the skillsets, but I think they're ultimately pretty distinct. Some of my favourite roleplayers can't write for shit.


Interesting thing: I know, personally, a couple dozen roleplayers, and I'm in a community with somewhere over one hundred roleplayers. Maybe 1% of them consider themselves writers, the rest just like to roleplay, and they tend to view the two separately.

This is what I see you are essentially saying: the difference between writing a story and chain-writing a story is that the latter requires you to associate with the other writers.


I'll strip this apart for myself:


You say that writing one's own story requires "focus" and "discipline" to create an entire plot and keep record of characters in setting. In the view of a GM, you essentially say the same thing, except to imply that there's more to keep track of because there are other contributors involved.


Strictly speaking, an author and a GM both have one plot. An author can create multiple characters for their story, and a group role-play is built from a casting call. Characters inherently have their own subplots, the only difference is an author can choose which of their characters are strictly plot devices or whose personal stories will further be elaborated throughout the story. A role-player's character development is always available in full detail because they are assuming that character, their development comes about either from inner-monologue or interaction, and role-players may selectively create their own additional NPCs to serve as plot devices for their own. An author is not barred from stepping into the mindset of character, either. You cannot portray a character if you cannot think for their intents--it is not strictly a skill of a role-player.


You say a GM has to be a good communicator. I assume you mean among the people who signed up to their plot, in which case, yes. That said, we can view it as a good communicator of plot as well. While a GM has to "drip-feed" their plot cues to participants, as you've put it, so does an author. The author has to parse their own plot along to their reader. In the case of a group role-play, the GM's priority readers are the participants, and everyone is highly encouraged to read each others' posts, particularly in interactive role-play where setting is more contained and not a free-roam "sandbox" universe. In fact, if it were a sandbox role-play, you would basically be writing your very own story that stars your character, with the occasional joint post thrown in there, but I digress. If a GM truly needed to guide everyone in a certain direction, they have OOC chat for that, and if they wanted to tell everyone straight up what they wanted to do, they could, and should.


Writing one's own story, you write your own "texture" to your universe in the same way that a role-player who is enthusiastic about quality posts will do the same thing. You made a point to say that group role-play "doesn't prevent improper writers to be involved", but let's be honest here: a lot of people consider themselves "writers" who also have things they can improve on, like fluid syntax or scene plotting, or randomly injecting too much voice in what was otherwise third-person narration--it's whatever. "Writer" is a title that holds about as much weight as a college student who likes to paint calling themselves an "artist." Anyone can be a "writer". Anyone can be "published" now. You can go and create your own book on Wattpad, you can pin up chapters on Fanfiction.net, you can host your own blog website of your stories, you can pass out read-only PDF documents--because in this day and age, you don't necessarily have to have a book in print to be published, but it'll get there if you call someone up enough about it to press out the papers. You don't have to be "proper" to call yourself a writer. You just need to have a platform, an audience, and enough self confidence to name yourself as such. Becoming an established novelist, though, is something else, and sales figures and consequential broader public recognition are some key differentiation.


In short, either mode of writing is comparable. You are writing a story, one by yourself, and the other with the influence of other people whom you may have to talk to every so often to hope they're on the same page and are still on board with the idea. This is my view.