CLAWS OF THE SILVER MOON, WTF?

[Djalan Pride]

CLAWS OF THE SILVER MOON


Cost: 4m, 1wp; Mins: Strength 3, Essence 2;


Type: Simple (Speed 4)


Keywords: Combo-OK, Gift, Obvious


Duration: One scene


Prerequisite Charms: None


Channeling a nimbus of silver from her soul into her hands, the Lunar endows them with large, vicious silver claws. The claws improve the statistics of the character’s basic natural attacks as follows: Speed +0, Accuracy +2, Damage +(Strength)L, Defense +0, Rate +0, and they may be used to parry lethal damage without magic or stunts. If the character possesses other natural attacks (in addition to kick or clinch, which are already affected), she may spend one extra mote to add the Charm’s bonuses to those attack forms as well.


Once a character with this Charm reaches Essence 3, she may spend two additional motes to make the claws slimmer and more needlelike, providing Accuracy +(Dexterity). At Essence 4, she may spend another two motes to give the weapon Damage +(Strength + 2)L/(Essence + 1) and the Overwhelming tag. These extra options may be activated together or separately.


so maxed out at essence 4, what are the final bonuses?


is it


(A)


Acc + (dex), Dam +(str +2)L/(Ess + 1)


or


(B)


Acc +(dex+2), Dam +((strx2)+2)L/(Ess + 1)

 

[StarHawk]

When I played, I had the same question. How its written I am inclined to go with statement B. But is ultimately up to the storyteller.

 

[Haku1]

The text is fairly clear in itself. And it's B.

 

[Flagg]

I'd say A. Nothing in the language of the Charm suggests that these are cumulative bonuses. Quite the opposite, in fact.

 

[Persell]

I agree with Flagg.


Language issues aside the charm is already insanely powerful (*cough*tyrantlizard*cough*) there is really no need to power it up any further.

 

[Arthur]

The text seems not to be clear, but the A) option would be way more balanced.


Claws is already too strong.

 

[Flagg]

The text is clear, yes. Nowhere does it say "adds" or "additional" or "stack". The values given for higher Essence levels are clearly replacement stats, not bonuses.

 

[Arthur]

The values given for higher Essence levels are clearly replacement stats, not bonuses.

The text doens't state that.

 

[Flagg]

The text doens't state that.

It absoutely does.

providing Accuracy +(Dexterity)

If this were a bonus, it would say something like "adding +(Dexterity) to accuracy".

give the weapon Damage +(Strength + 2)L/(Essence + 1) and the Overwhelming tag.

Again, it would say, "adds +(Strength + 2)L/(Essence + 1)..."


However, it doesn't say these things. It says (to paraphrase) "At Essence X, [the stat in question] becomes Z".


I don't see how you can read it any other way.

 

[Ker'ion]

After reviewing the Charm's precise wording (and checking it against the book for even the most minor difference - good job with the precision BTW), I'm going with a strict interpretation of A.


Two motes to add (Strength +2)L to Damage and an Essence +1 Overwhelming seems a little overpowered. Adding 2 dice to the Damage and the +1 Overwhelming seems fair for two motes.


If it doesn't make sense, then obviously the first alteration can't stack either.


Sorry, but, being naturally distrustful, I had to check it against the book's writings.

 

[Djalan Pride]

thank you, (A) it is then.


i'm trying to give a clear answer to one of my players, and i couldn't quite decide myself.


thanks again mates,


d.p.

 

[Haku1]

By the by... I'm looking at the charm again in question.


I'm noticing that Lunars get speed +0 to the attacks.


Given that you guys seem to think that the stats from the charm -replaces- the unarmed attack stats, does this mean that the lunar now has speed 0?


Think I'm mad? Look at the -base- charm claws and see what I mean.

 

[MrMephistopheles]

While it could have been worded differently, no. It just is a placeholder to let you know that the natural attack's enhanced through the charm don't change from their normal default speed.

 

[NateDojo]

While it could have been worded differently, no. It just is a placeholder to let you know that the natural attack's enhanced through the charm don't change from their normal default speed.

I concur!

 

[Haku1]

Oh, come now... it serves as a notation that the unarmed attack is modified with those charm boost much like an 'unarmed' weapon... oxymoron as that is... like claws mutation mod your attack to give you lethal damage.


Granted, re-reading the text, I have to agree that it's option A that the fully boosted claws give you.

 

[Chaka]

I'd allow B, simply because it's a decent chunk of essence and a point of willpower, and also because if a lunar wants to rip someone apart with hands infused with raw silver from their souls, I'm all for that.


YMMV.

 

[Dracogryff]

I'd allow B, simply because it's a decent chunk of essence and a point of willpower, and also because if a lunar wants to rip someone apart with hands infused with raw silver from their souls, I'm all for that.
YMMV.

Unless you happen to activate it with Deadly Beastman, in which case it costs a mere commitement of three motes and no willpower. And trust me, you can shred someone handily with option A alone, without making it obscenely better than any artifact weapon out there (possibly excepting the Grand Goremaul, don't recall how nasty that baby was).

 

[cyl]

B, as simply as the text stated it. Exalted is about stacking sometimes (don't even bother trying to say you don't like it ^^)

 

[Smeggedoff]

I'm all for Lunars being able to rip people a new one if you piss them off so I'd go B too


however I reserve the right to change my mind if I'm ever DMing and a player pisses ME off with them, being a hypocrite has some nice perks sometimes

 

[MrMephistopheles]

Post subject: Re: CLAWS OF THE SILVER MOON, WTF? Reply with quote


B, as simply as the text stated it. Exalted is about stacking sometimes (don't even bother trying to say you don't like it ^^)

It can be. This just isn't one of those cases. It's A. As is, the gift charm is rather strong. And it should be noted, it enhances ALL natural attacks, not just punches.

 

[Ker'ion]

Unless you happen to activate it with Deadly Beastman, in which case it costs a mere commitement of three motes and no willpower. And trust me, you can shred someone handily with option A alone, without making it obscenely better than any artifact weapon out there (possibly excepting the Grand Goremaul, don't recall how nasty that baby was).

Grand Goremaul
Speed: 5


Accuracy: +1


Damage: 16L/5


Defense: +1


Rate: 2


Strength: 4


Attune: 8


Artifact: 3


Tags: 2-Handed, Overwhelming, Piercing, Reach


Now add the MM bonus and go play outside. Yer botherin' me.

 

[Haku1]

A moonsilver grand goremaul is all kinds of love, y'know.

 

[Smeggedoff]

ooh, for some reason that makes me think of moonsilver superheavy plate.

 

[Persell]

ooh, for some reason that makes me think of moonsilver superheavy plate.

If you're going to dish out five dots for armour, I much prefer Moonsilver Celestial Battle Armour. I particularly like the way that Moonsilver armour practically never hampers Lunar Charms. DBT (Stone Body, Armour-Forming Technique) + Moonsilver Celestial Battle Armour is very, very fun.

 

[Smeggedoff]

true dat