Celestials Style?

[magnificentmomo]

I was thinking of creating a celestial MA based on the Celestials. The primary focus of the style would be multiple flavors of the form that can be changed to with a diceless reflexive action once per dv refresh. Going from the raw power of the US, the meandering flow of Luna, and the Precision of the Maidens. There would be charms that are only usable in each form, and I am thinking the pinnacle charm(s) would have to do with either eclipses or Calibration.


Questions? Comments? Concerns?


I could also use a better name than Celestials Style. Perhaps Celestial Incarnae Style? Celestial Movement Style?

 

[brennanhawkwood]

Heaven's Dance Style?


Could be interesting.  The idea doesn't really 'sing' to me, but that doesn't mean it couldn't end up working out well.

 

[Dracogryff]

Based on the incarnae? Huh....seems wierd to me, but if you wannt a have fun with it, go for it, I guess. *shrugs* Doesn't sound interesting to me, though.


Though I'm not sure that one celestial MA would be sufficient to encomass every incarna in it...that seems awfully expansive, in a way. One for each Incarna..? But then, that could be Hero styles...meh. I don't think it sounds like a good idea, but I'm picky on MA, and not really all that good on understanding balance and flows and all that business, so who knows.


Just sounds more like a Sidereal level, with the breadth it covers...and I'm not fond of them much. Eh...donno. I could be wrong. I have been before.

 

[Ledaal Kajiri]

I have to agree that the idea sounds more like a Sidereal level style than a Celestial level style, particullarly as it sounds like the best charm tree for you to look at when designing such would be Prismatic Arrangement of Creation, as the most similar existing style. While Celestial Style can involve some significant esoteric concepts, at the Celestial level it is generally a single concept. Pushing to Incarna as the concept, I would think is likely to result in a Sidereal level martial art, more so if it actually emulates them in any significant fashion.

 

[magnificentmomo]

Twas just a brainfart. I thought having a form charm that changes from giving a big boost to damage, to dodge, or accuracy, among other things would be interesting. I am relatively new to Exalted and haven't explored MA's in complete depth, nor have I ever designed a MA. Like I said, twas just a brainfart.

 

[Persell]

Based on the incarnae? Huh....seems wierd to me, but if you wannt a have fun with it, go for it, I guess. *shrugs* Doesn't sound interesting to me, though.
Though I'm not sure that one celestial MA would be sufficient to encomass every incarna in it...that seems awfully expansive, in a way. One for each Incarna..? But then, that could be Hero styles...meh. I don't think it sounds like a good idea, but I'm picky on MA, and not really all that good on understanding balance and flows and all that business, so who knows.


Just sounds more like a Sidereal level, with the breadth it covers...and I'm not fond of them much. Eh...donno. I could be wrong. I have been before.

I second that totally.

 

[Ker'ion]

Thirded!

 

[magnificentmomo]

Just started reading about prismatic arrangement of Creation style... and all of the SMA (which I had put off for god knows why) and I am scared.

 

[Chaka]

Just started reading about prismatic arrangement of Creation style... and all of the SMA (which I had put off for god knows why) and I am scared.

As well you should be.

 

[skafte]

If you just make is high essence, like starting on 5 or 6, I don't see any problem with it being Celestial instead of SMA. Sidereals doesn't seem flexible enough to make up such a style, where as a Lunar might do it in an effort to become more one with the whole of creation.

 

[Lord Kamina]

As I understand it, Celestial styles wrap around a Concept.


Be it the animals, or shadows, or weaving or whatever.


So, a Celestial Style could be based on UCS, for example. On Perfection, let's say... No, the way I see it, that exists and it's called Solar Hero Style.


I am pretty sure a style based in the incarnae could be made, I think it might be cool, but I'd say it most definitely should be a Sidereal style.

 

[magnificentmomo]

I just liked the idea of a form that changed on a once per action reflexive as interesting. And I happened to be in Astronomy when I was thinking about it.

 

[Lord Kamina]

I was really tired when I typed that.


Basically I meant to say that a Celestial style could deal with a single Incarna (But I think they do exist already, and are the hero styles, pretty much)


A Sidereal level would be needed to represent all of them at once.

 

[Coyotekin]

A Sidereal style would be appropriate for this form. If you take the Prismatic Arrangement of Creation style as a basis for the style, working on each of the 4, eventually working into maybe a final two Charms that combines all of th easpects then you should be good to go.

 

[Persell]

Procession of the Heavens Style?


Anyways it seems pretty cool.

 

[Chaka]

Indeed, it's an interesting idea. If you want a hand hammering it out, i'd be happy to help.

 

[wordman]

I have to agree that the idea sounds more like a Sidereal level style than a Celestial level style.... While Celestial Style can involve some significant esoteric concepts' date=' at the Celestial level it is generally a single concept. Pushing to Incarna as the concept, I would think is likely to result in a Sidereal level martial art, more so if it actually emulates them in any significant fashion.[/quote']
I've been thinking about this statement for a couple of days and have come to believe that it is wrong.


The idea that certain concepts always map to certain levels of martial arts seems dubious to me. It isn't the concept itself that matters, but rather how it is used.


Celestial styles gain martial arts magic by emulating something: an animal (such as a snake, mantis, tiger, nightingale), an ideal (compassion, righteous cleansing) or an idealized being (performer, hero, dominatrix). The martial artist acts like a concept in order to inflict his will.


Sidereal styles, on the other hand, are about altering reality with a metaphor. They do not seek to emulate anything, but rather either embody it or wield it as a weapon. The martial artist directly manipulates a concept in order to inflict his will.


The OP's idea is to create a style "based on the Celestials". Whether or not such a style is more "properly" a celestial or sidereal style depends entirely on the approach that is taken. It is possible to build a well-balanced style using either, I think.


Now, it is certainly much more difficult to build a celestial style "based on the Celestials" without it becoming munchy. I think most people's reactions essentially amount to "it should be a sidereal style because sidereal styles are supposed to be munchy". This seems like  spurious reasoning to me, particularly without a specific implementation available to critique.


One approach for making it a celestial style might be to avoid emulating the Incarna themselves, but rather some kind of idealized "celestial monk", trying to take a single lesson from each Incarna and emulate those lessons into a lifestyle. Binding mechanics to these lessons would be challenging. In particular, most celestial arts have one or more "holes" in their charm set. That is, given five basic effect areas (attack, damage, defense, mobility, soak), most arts aren't very good at at least one of these areas. This might be difficult to accomplish believably using lessons of the Incarna. One way around this might be to give the art some sort of defects representing a philosophy clash between the lessons. For example, maybe it is impossible to apply the lessons of Battle and Serenty at the same time. Maybe the Moon needs the night, so can't function when the sun is blazing.


Don't get me wrong here. I, too, think that building a sidereal style based on the Incarna would be easier (though the exact metaphor being manipulated is an interesting question). I just don't agree that an attempt to build a celestial version is automatically invalid.

 

[Persell]

Celestial styles gain martial arts magic by emulating something: an animal (such as a snake, mantis, tiger, nightingale), an ideal (compassion, righteous cleansing) or an idealized being (performer, hero, dominatrix). The martial artist acts like a concept in order to inflict his will.


Sidereal styles, on the other hand, are about altering reality with a metaphor. They do not seek to emulate anything, but rather either embody it or wield it as a weapon. The martial artist directly manipulates a concept in order to inflict his will.

I think you are in theory right, but sadly not in practice. Most MA are poorly written and if there ever existed powerlevel or theme considerations for them they have long been forgotten by the designers.

 

[Moonsilver]

I don't see a problem here, to keep it Celestial just tone down the power level. Having lots of differant powers in an MA do not alone make it a Sideral MA.


You could have an even weaker Terestrial version if you wanted.