A question about comic 38 and the locators...

[VoidPointer]

This may have been brought up before, but I can't find the issue brought up anywhere, and the discussion thread for comic 38 seems to be missing, so: What does the fact that half the locators are broken have to do with Secret? Why can't Misho tell her what it has to do with her? What does all this have to do with Misho's Motivation?


The only hypothesis I can come up with is that the locators she's looking at track Exaltations, which would explain why oh, about 150 of them shattered, but that has its own problems, such as, "If that is the case, then why didn't the Bronze Faction loot them centuries ago to help with the Wyld Hunt?"

 

[Joe_Mello]

How far have you read?

 

[VoidPointer]

I knew I forgot to mention something! I've read everything so far; I was just re-reading and came to the realization that I hadn't ever puzzled out this particular question.


(edited: because semicolons join independent clauses)

 

[Arrghus]

"If that is the case, then why didn't the Bronze Faction loot them centuries ago to help with the Wyld Hunt?"

Because the library could only be unlocked by a Solar?


Also, why do you think it has to be Misho's Motivation?

 

[Joe_Mello]

The only hypothesis I can come up with is that the locators she's looking at track Exaltations, which would explain why oh, about 150 of them shattered, but that has its own problems, such as, "If that is the case, then why didn't the Bronze Faction loot them centuries ago to help with the Wyld Hunt?"

Because it was floating in the air and probably well guarded. The reason why they all shattered could probably be attributed to physics (yes, it still exists).


As for why Secret's not allowed to know, hindsight says that one or more of them might be tied to cleansing tainted shards or that Secret herself has a tainted shard (so her locator would be shattered), but I'm guessing it's simply because it's the last panel, and that was a decent punchline.

 

[VoidPointer]

Because the library could only be unlocked by a Solar?

... Right. Forgot about that. Still, I imagine that a competent Sidereal circle with the backing of the Bronze faction could probably achieve the epic task of opening a door.

Also, why do you think it has to be Misho's Motivation?

Jukashi's commentary at the bottom says something to that effect.

Because it was floating in the air and probably well guarded. The reason why they all shattered could probably be attributed to physics (yes, it still exists).

Well-guarded by whom? For the entire Shogunate period, the manse would probably have been empty of Anathema, leaving only the automated manse defenses to contend with, and judging by the fact that what's-her-name, Chosen of Mars, used to hang out there, they probably weren't set to shoot Sidereals on sight. "Floating in the air" I'll grant you, but we're talking about a highly motivated group of Sidereals and a series of artifacts that could make their jobs a lot easier.


As for their shattering having to do with physics, aren't the locator cards artifacts? My (admittedly limited and quite possibly mistaken) understanding is that artifacts are more or less indestructible by normal means. This, combined with Misho's comment that the cards shatter if the object they track is destroyed or fundamentally altered, and his tight-lipped response as to why they shattered, suggests that their destruction wasn't the result of a sudden impact.

As for why Secret's not allowed to know, hindsight says that one or more of them might be tied to cleansing tainted shards or that Secret herself has a tainted shard (so her locator would be shattered), but I'm guessing it's simply because it's the last panel, and that was a decent punchline.

If they can be tied to Exaltations, this would be my guess, but I would wonder how much this gels with Misho's Motivation given that he doesn't seem to know much about Abyssals at this point.

 

[ShadowDragon8685]

... Right. Forgot about that. Still, I imagine that a competent Sidereal circle with the backing of the Bronze faction could probably achieve the epic task of opening a door.

Without Mew Cai setting off the "shatter every damn card in the place" failsafe?


I'd bet a lot that Mew Cai was absolutely aware of the Usurpation. After all, her Motivation was apparently to protect the crystals and safeguard the interests of the Solar Exalted. Chances are that she discerned that the Fivescore Fellowship were all enemies of that Motivation after they, you know, ganked the Solars.


So she was probably standing by to blast the crystals at the very first sign that any Sidereals - or anyone else - was trying to get access to them. And Sidereals, as we all know, are the Gimp Exalted. Neither they, nor the Terrestrial Exalted, would have had the magical chops to sneak in or fool Mew Cai into thinking they were Solars.


Probably they decided it was better to leave it in place, reasoning that if they ever had a really good reason to get in, it would be simpler to find one of those loose thirteen Solars and manipulate him into welcoming them in.

Well-guarded by whom? For the entire Shogunate period, the manse would probably have been empty of Anathema, leaving only the automated manse defenses to contend with, and judging by the fact that what's-her-name, Chosen of Mars, used to hang out there, they probably weren't set to shoot Sidereals on sight. "Floating in the air" I'll grant you, but we're talking about a highly motivated group of Sidereals and a series of artifacts that could make their jobs a lot easier.

Faen Luif, and she hung out at Misho's place. The floating safeguard place was not Misho's place.


That said, a Sidereal was probably not KoS in the floating manse any more than Terrestrial Exalted, but they most likely would not have been permitted access to the card library, with Mew Cai having rigged the crystal shatterer on a hair-trigger should she sense any disruption in the library or her own persona.

As for their shattering having to do with physics, aren't the locator cards artifacts? My (admittedly limited and quite possibly mistaken) understanding is that artifacts are more or less indestructible by normal means. This, combined with Misho's comment that the cards shatter if the object they track is destroyed or fundamentally altered, and his tight-lipped response as to why they shattered, suggests that their destruction wasn't the result of a sudden impact.

This understanding is correct. Under normal circumstances, assuming fragility wasn't a built-in flaw, artifacts are indestructible. The cards Secret commented on are almost unquestionably Solar Exaltations. That was, after all, the build-up to the punch-line.

If they can be tied to Exaltations, this would be my guess, but I would wonder how much this gels with Misho's Motivation given that he doesn't seem to know much about Abyssals at this point.

Possibly Jukashi forgot that Misho didn't know much about Abyssals (to say nothing of Infernals) at the time, or overruled that minor plot hole for the sake of the punch-line.

 

[VoidPointer]

*snip the explanation about Mew Cai and the failsafe*

Good point. Sidereals are sneaky, but probably not *that* sneaky. Or that hard-working. :mrgreen:

Faen Luif, and she hung out at Misho's place. The floating safeguard place was not Misho's place.

*checks*


... Ah. You're right. I must have gotten the one First Age place that Misho frequented with all-white decor and a bunch of Exalted hanging out with the *other* First Age place that Misho frequented with all-white decor and a bunch of Exalted hanging out. I can't see how I could have done *that*. xD

This understanding is correct. Under normal circumstances, assuming fragility wasn't a built-in flaw, artifacts are indestructible. The cards Secret commented on are almost unquestionably Solar Exaltations. That was, after all, the build-up to the punch-line.

If they can be tied to Exaltations, this would be my guess, but I would wonder how much this gels with Misho's Motivation given that he doesn't seem to know much about Abyssals at this point.

Possibly Jukashi forgot that Misho didn't know much about Abyssals (to say nothing of Infernals) at the time, or overruled that minor plot hole for the sake of the punch-line.

Good points. It sets kind of a creepy precedent that Exaltations can be tracked like that, but then again so does the Jade Prison (and so do a number of *other* things in the setting), so the creepiness is perfectly on point. Thanks for helping me puzzle this out.

 

[ShadowDragon8685]

Good point. Sidereals are sneaky, but probably not *that* sneaky. Or that hard-working. :mrgreen:

Probably they figured there was nothing in there worth the risk of destroying the whole library for. After all, if it's Inside Fate and they need it BAD, they have other ways to find it.

*checks*
... Ah. You're right. I must have gotten the one First Age place that Misho frequented with all-white decor and a bunch of Exalted hanging out with the *other* First Age place that Misho frequented with all-white decor and a bunch of Exalted hanging out. I can't see how I could have done *that*. xD

I bet that it was easy for Exalts to forget that shit sometimes, too. Misho doesn't sleep not because of the things he sees in his dreams, but because one time he was so passed-out tired he forgot where he was when he woke up. He meant to get out of bed and go to the loo in the middle of the night, but in his confusion he accidentally opened the balcony window and took a header off the flying Manse's side before he realized where he was.


That kind of shit can be embarrassing, yanno. Allll the way down, landed in the river underneath the Manse, and when he was fished out, was noted to remark that he no longer needed the restroom, or the shower.

Good points. It sets kind of a creepy precedent that Exaltations can be tracked like that, but then again so does the Jade Prison (and so do a number of *other* things in the setting), so the creepiness is perfectly on point. Thanks for helping me puzzle this out.

The locator cards could probably be scrambled by the simple expedient of a Passive, always-on Stealth Charm for Solars and Dexterity Charm for Lunars.

 

[VoidPointer]

The locator cards could probably be scrambled by the simple expedient of a Passive, always-on Stealth Charm for Solars and Dexterity Charm for Lunars.

Oh, almost certainly. It's not a game balance issue, it's just that for some weird reason, I just find it more disturbing that someone could track the Exaltations than that they could track the Exalted.

I bet that it was easy for Exalts to forget that shit sometimes, too. Misho doesn't sleep not because of the things he sees in his dreams, but because one time he was so passed-out tired he forgot where he was when he woke up. He meant to get out of bed and go to the loo in the middle of the night, but in his confusion he accidentally opened the balcony window and took a header off the flying Manse's side before he realized where he was.


That kind of shit can be embarrassing, yanno. Allll the way down, landed in the river underneath the Manse, and when he was fished out, was noted to remark that he no longer needed the restroom, or the shower.

... I love this idea and wish to subscribe to its newsletter. It's like those stories people tell of when they were drunk and in college (but I repeat myself), but with rockodiles and iconic anima banners.


And now I want to run Exalted Animal House in whatever the First Age's equivalent of the Heptagram was. Complete with panty raids on the Lunar quarters. :mrgreen:


(edit: drunk has an r in it)

 

[Greenstalker]

Well I don't think those locators points out to exaltations. Why? Misho said that those locators indicates to 'particular magical constructs that was deemed to be of importance' so if there is only a few hundreds of them than where are the artifact pointers? How about other exaltations? In total there should be 700 celestial exaltations why just keep solar ones? I think those locators shows level 5+ artifact locations instead (for record I think Karen's sword counts as at least level 5 being able to folded and can be used by warstriders are not easy tasks and Misho gaved Marena that locator)


Ofcourse all of these MHO (and probably I am wrong.........as usual ) I wasn't around when that comic drawn and didn't see any discussion about it either.

 

[ShadowDragon8685]

Green, it was the Solar Exaltations which got perverted, 100 by the Neverborn, 50 by the Yozis. The Exaltations of the Lunars and Sidereals are intact. (For various values of intact, but still there.)


As for Karen's sword, it's just an Art 3 Grand Daiklaive as far as I know. Nothing in it works out as being particularly special; folding is not, in and of itself, enough to warrant anything whatsoever, and any Warstrider can swing a Grand Daiklaive one-handed, as they all have a STR bonus of 9+.

 

[Arrghus]

Also, why do you think it has to be Misho's Motivation?

Jukashi's commentary at the bottom says something to that effect.

You misunderstand me. I'm not asking why it has to be Misho's Motivation, I'm asking why it has to be Misho's Motivation.

 

[Synapse]

Well...I'd say it's Marena's and it tracks exaltations because, well, Karen.


But...at the same time, there's something else. They took more than just Karen's one, if it tracks exaltation shards, and not all of them were related to Marena.


And she only found out she has an exaltee child much later.

 

[Arrghus]

They're tracking the keys, which was why they were there in the first place, but Misho also took the time to find Karen's locator (since there was no key in Nova's territory and they left once they found Karen, it's safe to say they were there to find her).


My guess is Marena's Motivation is something along the lines of "Reunite with my family (minus mom)", which starts with Karen and (supposedly) ends with the kids. This fits with her actions (for starters, she hijacked the group to go look for Karen, that's a pretty big thing) her stated goals and dreams (Dying, all she thinks of is her daughter) and the shape of the plot itself (note how many weird things happen that make it more complicated for Marena to find her family).

 

[Ryvaken Tadrya]

I don't usually do this, but there is fail here.

Because it was floating in the air and probably well guarded. The reason why they all shattered could probably be attributed to physics (yes, it still exists).

Well-guarded by whom? For the entire Shogunate period, the manse would probably have been empty of Anathema, leaving only the automated manse defenses to contend with, and judging by the fact that what's-her-name, Chosen of Mars, used to hang out there, they probably weren't set to shoot Sidereals on sight. "Floating in the air" I'll grant you, but we're talking about a highly motivated group of Sidereals and a series of artifacts that could make their jobs a lot easier.

First reference: http://keychain.patternspider.net/archive/koc0006.html Crashed during the Contagion


Second reference: http://keychain.patternspider.net/archive/koc0028.html Evacuated during crash


Third reference: http://keychain.patternspider.net/archive/koc0040.html Dragonblooded killed during the Contagion.


Analysis: The manse was occupied by the Shogunate. The Sidereals had easy access. Your reading fu is weak.

 

[Greenstalker]

Most probably other than a few solars noone knew about locators and mew-cai was programed only to unlock locators room if a solar with password (or known essence) wants access.

 

[Arrghus]

I don't usually do this, but there is fail here.

Because it was floating in the air and probably well guarded. The reason why they all shattered could probably be attributed to physics (yes, it still exists).

Well-guarded by whom? For the entire Shogunate period, the manse would probably have been empty of Anathema, leaving only the automated manse defenses to contend with, and judging by the fact that what's-her-name, Chosen of Mars, used to hang out there, they probably weren't set to shoot Sidereals on sight. "Floating in the air" I'll grant you, but we're talking about a highly motivated group of Sidereals and a series of artifacts that could make their jobs a lot easier.

First reference: http://keychain.patternspider.net/archive/koc0006.html Crashed during the Contagion


Second reference: http://keychain.patternspider.net/archive/koc0028.html Evacuated during crash


Third reference: http://keychain.patternspider.net/archive/koc0040.html Dragonblooded killed during the Contagion.


Analysis: The manse was occupied by the Shogunate. The Sidereals had easy access. Your reading fu is weak.

Please try to keep track of your coding, so as to avoid the mistake of attributing the above quote of Void_Pointer's design to me.


Besides, even if the Dragonblooded occupied the Manse itself, this comic implies that only a Solar could access the library itself.